Wsb phenomenon (Politics version)

[doodle]

The wall street bets phenomenon is small time retail organizing and sticking it to wall street

We need wall street bets level of organization packaged into a labor movement...as I mentioned before ...government can stand back. Perhaps this is the vindication of social media if it can organize workers movements to reallocate money from billionaire capitalists and ceos back into hands of workers. This could be the way to combine freedom and redistribution sans government.

[I Shrugged]

The wall street bets phenomenon is small time retail organizing and sticking it to wall street

We need wall street bets level of organization packaged into a labor movement...as I mentioned before ...government can stand back. Perhaps this is the vindication of social media if it can organize workers movements to reallocate money from billionaire capitalists and ceos back into hands of workers. This could be the way to combine freedom and redistribution sans government.

Ask yourself who really runs the government. You’re setting yourself up for a bigger disappointment than the Trump voters got.

[doodle]

The wall street bets phenomenon is small time retail organizing and sticking it to wall street

We need wall street bets level of organization packaged into a labor movement...as I mentioned before ...government can stand back. Perhaps this is the vindication of social media if it can organize workers movements to reallocate money from billionaire capitalists and ceos back into hands of workers. This could be the way to combine freedom and redistribution sans government.

Ask yourself who really runs the government. You’re setting yourself up for a bigger disappointment than the Trump voters got.

We the people really run this show, it's just that we have let them make us forget that. Same with the economy. The workers run the show, it's just that they have lacked the appropriate means to organize and collectively negotiate for their piece of the pie. We don't need government minimum wage laws if labor can wake up and organize.

Things can only stay out of balance for so long before there is a reaction...which we have been witnessing (albeit in a confused fashion) start to unfold really since 2008.

[Tortoise]

(Moved post to the "GME" thread)

[Kriegsspiel]

Wrong thread, Tortoise, this one is about the workers of the world uniting.

[Tortoise]

Good point, Kriegs. I'll move my post into the GME thread.

[doodle]

The wall street bets phenomenon is small time retail organizing and sticking it to wall street

We need Wall Street bets level of organization packaged into a labor movement...as I mentioned before ...government can stand back. Perhaps this is the vindication of social media if it can organize workers movements to reallocate money from billionaire capitalists and ceos back into hands of workers. This could be the way to combine freedom and redistribution sans government.

As a long-time registered Democrat, I agree. Start a subreddit. /r/RedLaborRules which has a catchy 3 letter acronym: RLR, which has our official color of our political party, red, it’s descriptive since it’s about labor, and we rule, literally (as in power) and figuratively (as in being awesome) and once we amass enough support, we’ll get to write the rules, for a third meaning.

Start the subreddit, make me a mod, and I’ll help bring prosperity to our country’s labor force, comrade

Your prodigious intellect will certainly serve our movement well! Tell me comrade, does wiping your ass with newspaper or cardboard make your heart sing more?

And do not despair about this american housing bubble! Soon you will have your own* little dacha that you can decorate with nesting dolls and artwork approved by the central committee!

*Property of workers party

[I Shrugged]

Well the swamp/Wall Street/government (but I repeat myself) is mounting a counter- offensive today.

[doodle]

Well the swamp/Wall Street/government (but I repeat myself) is mounting a counter- offensive today.

Can you expand on the government's role?

[vnatale]

SEC Needs to Act on GameStop: Valliere


https://www.thinkadvisor.com/2021/01/28 ... -valliere/



Though the Securities and Exchange Commission may not want to deal with the trading frenzy surrounding video game retailer GameStop, it likely will have to do so anyway, according to Washington insider Greg Valliere, who is chief U.S. policy strategist for AGF Investments.

The regulator “may have no choice because officials know this could end badly for the financial markets and individual investors,” he wrote in his latest Capitol Insights blog post Thursday.

“After years of overlooking predatory hedge funds that have hammered fragile companies into extinction, the SEC is hearing from hedge funds that now want protection — as the hunter becomes the hunted,” Valliere explained.

The burst in the trading and price of GameStop and AMC shares “has gotten Washington’s attention. Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen has her first crisis, just two days on the job, and even the White House is monitoring this,” he added.

“No one in the new administration wants to see market instability; the focus here is still on COVID-19,” Valliere stated.

[I Shrugged]

Well the swamp/Wall Street/government (but I repeat myself) is mounting a counter- offensive today.

Can you expand on the government's role?

No, but to me it walks, looks, and quacks like a duck. Just look at all of the actions being taken against WSB, all at once. So I don't know if it's a conspiracy theory, or just a theory. But I think it'd be naive to not suspect something.

[doodle]

Well the swamp/Wall Street/government (but I repeat myself) is mounting a counter- offensive today.

Can you expand on the government's role?

No, but to me it walks, looks, and quacks like a duck. Just look at all of the actions being taken against WSB, all at once. So I don't know if it's a conspiracy theory, or just a theory. But I think it'd be naive to not suspect something.

I'll grant that the Fed has created an enormous amount of moral hazard by constantly bailing everyone out....which was precursor to most of this mess. But I think to blame them for behavior that is directly attributable to hedge fund manipulation is a bit of a stretch

[I Shrugged]

Well the swamp/Wall Street/government (but I repeat myself) is mounting a counter- offensive today.

Can you expand on the government's role?

No, but to me it walks, looks, and quacks like a duck. Just look at all of the actions being taken against WSB, all at once. So I don't know if it's a conspiracy theory, or just a theory. But I think it'd be naive to not suspect something.

I'll grant that the Fed has created an enormous amount of moral hazard by constantly bailing everyone out....which was precursor to most of this mess. But I think to blame them for behavior that is directly attributable to hedge fund manipulation is a bit of a stretch

To be clear, I'm saying the elites are the ones putting the stop on what WSB is doing. Your comment makes me think maybe you thought I was saying something else. Probably just my bad though.

[doodle]

Well the swamp/Wall Street/government (but I repeat myself) is mounting a counter- offensive today.

Can you expand on the government's role?

No, but to me it walks, looks, and quacks like a duck. Just look at all of the actions being taken against WSB, all at once. So I don't know if it's a conspiracy theory, or just a theory. But I think it'd be naive to not suspect something.

I'll grant that the Fed has created an enormous amount of moral hazard by constantly bailing everyone out....which was precursor to most of this mess. But I think to blame them for behavior that is directly attributable to hedge fund manipulation is a bit of a stretch

To be clear, I'm saying the elites are the ones putting the stop on what WSB is doing. Your comment makes me think maybe you thought I was saying something else. Probably just my bad though.

And you and I would be in agreement about that. But what is so confusing to me is that my criticism on this board of elites is met with shrieks that I'm a communist. I'm curious where exactly our philosophies differ then?

[I Shrugged]

And you and I would be in agreement about that. But what is so confusing to me is that my criticism on this board of elites is met with shrieks that I'm a communist. I'm curious where exactly our philosophies differ then?

Well I’m a 1 percenter, successful entrepreneur who employed a lot of people and paid a lot of taxes. You seem to want to take down me, and the elites. maybe you see me as an elite. I see me as a regular guy who ran a small business and did good for myself and society. I never used any pull or Ivy League connections to get myself set for life in some societally counter productive government-finance-swamp parasite job.

The system is more rigged against people like me than you, to be honest. In fact that’s why I “shrugged” it off. I got tired of being a golden goose for the swamp. No one appreciates employers, no, they are the oppressors. Yeah okay sure.

[dualstow]

The wall street bets phenomenon is small time retail organizing and sticking it to wall street

We need wall street bets level of organization packaged into a labor movement...as I mentioned before
...

Alright, there’s a thread for Wall Street Bets (WSB). It’s Smithers’ WSB Tavern.

The GME thread came along later, but it has a lot of posts and it can be GME specific.

This labor movement topic has been moved to Politics.

[Kriegsspiel]

At this point, it seems inevitable that Democrats are going to use this to ram through some overreaching laws that make things worse, rather than better. I'm thinking some kind of bait-n-switch like we've seen with the "coronavirus" bills that went through.

[doodle]

Well the swamp/Wall Street/government (but I repeat myself) is mounting a counter- offensive today.

Can you expand on the government's role?

No, but to me it walks, looks, and quacks like a duck. Just look at all of the actions being taken against WSB, all at once. So I don't know if it's a conspiracy theory, or just a theory. But I think it'd be naive to not suspect something.

I'll grant that the Fed has created an enormous amount of moral hazard by constantly bailing everyone out....which was precursor to most of this mess. But I think to blame them for behavior that is directly attributable to hedge fund manipulation is a bit of a stretch

To be clear, I'm saying the elites are the ones putting the stop on what WSB is doing. Your comment makes me think maybe you thought I was saying something else. Probably just my bad though.

And you and I would be in agreement about that. But what is so confusing to me is that my criticism on this board of elites is met with shrieks that I'm a communist. I'm curious where exactly our philosophies differ then?

Well I’m a 1 percenter, successful entrepreneur who employed a lot of people and paid a lot of taxes. You seem to want to take down me, and the elites. maybe you see me as an elite. I see me as a regular guy who ran a small business and did good for myself and society. I never used any pull or Ivy League connections to get myself set for life in some societally counter productive government-finance-swamp parasite job.

The system is more rigged against people like me than you, to be honest. In fact that’s why I “shrugged” it off. I got tired of being a golden goose for the swamp. No one appreciates employers, no, they are the oppressors. Yeah okay sure.

I'd like to nail down the definition of "elite", and at what point a relationship becomes parasitical?

I'm also curious why ordinary individuals organizing their interests on wallstreetbets receives bipartisan support but ordinary individuals organizing their interests in a similar forum to improve their wages at fast-food restaurants or walmart invites ire from the political right?

[InsuranceGuy]

[deleted]

[doodle]

I'm also curious why ordinary individuals organizing their interests on wallstreetbets receives bipartisan support but ordinary individuals organizing their interests in a similar forum to improve their wages at fast-food restaurants or walmart invites ire from the political right?

Both parties are hypocritical and always will be until one party becomes serious about solving issues instead of just campaigning about them (which is probably never).

That said, I think the political right are supportive of individuals organizing their interests in a similar forum to improve their wages in the way wallstreet bets does. This method seems to be the opposite of what they oppose in legacy unionization which require participation and waste their money with extravagent spending, political contributions, and other issue not related to collective bargaining.

The response I seem to get though is that this "workers of the world uniting" is somehow communism. If corporate management can strategize how to squeeze as much profit out of their operation as possible and lobby congress for beneficial legislation, why is it wrong for workers to strategize how they can squeeze out the highest salary possible and collectively lobby congress to disincentivize corporate offshoring of production to third world countries, or immigration policies which drive down wages? Could it backfire? Sure, at some point you kill the golden goose but hopefully you find a middle ground through negotiation.

Btw, I fully recognize that a lot of workers are pretty useless. I'm not advocating workers pushing for legislation that would prevent business from firing workers. Both sides have to be logical and reasonable about reality.

[ahhrunforthehills]

I'm also curious why ordinary individuals organizing their interests on wallstreetbets receives bipartisan support but ordinary individuals organizing their interests in a similar forum to improve their wages at fast-food restaurants or walmart invites ire from the political right?

Both parties are hypocritical and always will be until one party becomes serious about solving issues instead of just campaigning about them (which is probably never).

That said, I think the political right are supportive of individuals organizing their interests in a similar forum to improve their wages in the way wallstreet bets does. This method seems to be the opposite of what they oppose in legacy unionization which require participation and waste their money with extravagent spending, political contributions, and other issue not related to collective bargaining.

The response I seem to get though is that this "workers of the world uniting" is somehow communism. If corporate management can strategize how to squeeze as much profit out of their operation as possible and lobby congress for beneficial legislation, why is it wrong for workers to strategize how they can squeeze out the highest salary possible and collectively lobby congress to disincentivize corporate offshoring of production to third world countries, or immigration policies which drive down wages? Could it backfire? Sure, at some point you kill the golden goose but hopefully you find a middle ground through negotiation.

Btw, I fully recognize that a lot of workers are pretty useless. I'm not advocating workers pushing for legislation that would prevent business from firing workers. Both sides have to be logical and reasonable about reality.

There is no "middle ground' in running a business. If you ask anybody running a successful business about "middle ground" they will respond by saying that the business is "either growing or dying".

In most industries/sectors, any company with a sizable advantage is taking the lion's share. They have an advantage that allows them to offer a superior product and/or a lower price to customers. As long as you have large wage-disparity between countries, foreign companies will dominate US companies.

Question: How much money would an electric car cost if you traded in the 7 year old child-labor slaves in the Congo cobalt mines for a bunch of american union workers?? Think about it. Also realize that the very next day China will happily fill in your spot as slave owner to become the new market leader.

Funny thing how wages can effect profit margins. Every action has a reaction.

Increased wages = Increased operating expenses
Increased operating expenses = higher retail prices
Higher retail prices = increased purchases from non-american companies (that can hire cheaper labor)
Increased purchases from non-american companies = american company bankruptcies
Bankruptcies = Unemployment

Demanding higher wages, a better work environment, etc. is like putting a band-aid on a gunshot wound. You aren't even beginning to address the underlying problem. Wages are not stagnant because of some sneaky CEO behind the curtain. it is because Americans are nothing special. Redistributing wealth within a company doesn't just magically make everything honkey-dorey.

For example, is it fair if a US company offshore's their profits to avoid taxes? Now, before you make a gut-answer, let us compare a typical US company to one of its foreign competitors as of a few years ago (there have been law changes):

- Doodle Corp (pharma company): Make $1 million in 2020. Pays 35% in corporate taxes. $650k remaining in the Corp bank account (keep in mind that this money still belongs to the company... if you want to pay yourself ANY OF IT you will need to PAY TAXES A SECOND TIME.. but for this example, lets pretend that you are going to keep all of the money tied up in your company). $650k left for R&D to find the cure for cancer.

- Foreign competitor: Make $1 million in 2020. Only pays taxes when he pays himself a wage, distribution, etc. $1 Million left for R&D.

When Doodle Corp offshored those profits to avoid taxation, it simply leveled the playing field in the global market. Without it, foreign competitors will continually out-innovate and drive Doodle Corp out of business. It is just that simple.

The only way you get to legitimately increase wages for your own workers without slitting your own throat 10 years later is if you have a product/service that is COMPETITIVE IN THE WORLD MARKET through either better innovation, better productivity, or a distinct competitive advantage. That is the only way. Everything else is just shuffling deck chairs on the titanic.

So let's go through what makes America better than the competition?

1. Productivity? Don't make me laugh. My foreign workers would constantly work circles around my american workers. Plus, foreign workers were infinitely more grateful (despite paying my Americans $32/hr for a minimum wage level job). Americans go to college to get saddled in debt, get drunk, and learn essentially nothing that will be used in their actual career... then think they are special for some reason.

2. Innovation? Americans are way better than the rest of the world at... ? Ummm.... ? Surely, americans are good at something.... shopping, binge watching, starbucks? no, no... Oh wait, I got it... "technology". Yes, America is a leading innovator in TECHNOLOGY! Spending billions and billions on cutting edge research for a fabulous new widget... just to have the IP stolen by China 3 days later. Awesome plan.

No problem, we will just increase the costs of foreign imports to "encourage" people to buy american That won't hurt grandma on her fixed income who can barely afford her "made in china" adult diapers as it is. Sorry granny, the price just DOUBLED because now you are forced to buy them from the place that pays 10x more in wages while also being only 50% as productive (since we had to fill that quota for hiring age 60+ african-american-transgender-furries instead of hiring based on individual ability/skill).

Don't worry... if everything goes to hell, America always has its Plan B. Its real competitive advantage is being the largest arms dealer in the world. America will just start a war somewhere. Problem solved. Luckily, our children will not actually get shot at... a third of 17-24 year olds are too obese to qualify for military service. Maybe that's why we have moved to drones. American youth's only remaining skill was video games.

U-S-A!
U-S-A!
U-S-A!

[InsuranceGuy]

[deleted]

[I Shrugged]

....

Great rant!
No, there is nothing that makes a US school principal or plumber worth $100k while one in some secondary country makes 10k. Nothing.

Of the powerful nations, only the US survived WW2 in good condition. So we had the world at our feet. And we got fat and smug. We thought it was our destiny to have our cake and eat it too.

When the iron curtain fell, and when China decided to stop its nonsense, I knew the gravy train had to end. A couple billion people were going to realize that there were possibilities beyond eating dirt. How were we going to stop them?

We are living off the inheritance now. There’s still a lot left, but a growing number want to use force or coercion to get their “fair share” from someone else. If you’re worth more, the market tells you. If you’re not, it tells you that too.

Doodle, I hope Amazon does get unionized, to the max. I’ll laugh my ass off.

[Mark Leavy]

....

Great rant!
No, there is nothing that makes a US school principal or plumber worth $100k while one in some secondary country makes 10k. Nothing.

Of the powerful nations, only the US survived WW2 in good condition. So we had the world at our feet. And we got fat and smug. We thought it was our destiny to have our cake and eat it too.

When the iron curtain fell, and when China decided to stop its nonsense, I knew the gravy train had to end. A couple billion people were going to realize that there were possibilities beyond eating dirt. How were we going to stop them?

We are living off the inheritance now. There’s still a lot left, but a growing number want to use force or coercion to get their “fair share” from someone else. If you’re worth more, the market tells you. If you’re not, it tells you that too.

Doodle, I hope Amazon does get unionized, to the max. I’ll laugh my ass off.

Not just a great rant.

Serious Truth on the ground.
ahrunforthehills respect.

[doodle]

57b21102db5ce953008b6c77.jpeg (82.87 KiB) Viewed 3994 times

So business leadership is 20x more effective and valuable than it was in the 60s?