Is Trump doing a good job?

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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by vnatale » Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:02 pm

MangoMan wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 6:49 am
I don't understand that graphic of the US map, Vinny. Can you provide a link for some context, or some type of explanation? Thanks
There were few states in which the majority of eligible voters did vote and one of the candidates won the majority of those votes.

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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by pp4me » Mon Sep 07, 2020 4:37 pm

Sounds about right to me....

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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by WiseOne » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:07 pm

Whether or not the story is true....seriously, who cares? People are too busy packing up and moving out of cities beset with riots, crime, and overzealous COVID restrictions. The real news, *I* would think, is Bill DeBlasio saying he could solve all these problems if only he were allowed to impose high taxes on "the wealthy" - however he defines that - in order to distribute it to his favorite minorities. Actually I have no idea who he would distribute it to. His friends in City Hall are probably a safer bet.

If you compare something Trump maybe said years ago that was not in the best of taste to something bad enough to make you leave your home, I'd say the latter would be more important to most people. Plus, people already KNOW that Trump says stuff that's not in the best of taste. Another spate of news articles about that isn't going to shock anyone who hasn't been living under a rock for the past 3.5 years.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by I Shrugged » Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:38 pm

WiseOne wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:07 pm
Whether or not the story is true....seriously, who cares? People are too busy packing up and moving out of cities beset with riots, crime, and overzealous COVID restrictions. The real news, *I* would think, is Bill DeBlasio saying he could solve all these problems if only he were allowed to impose high taxes on "the wealthy" - however he defines that - in order to distribute it to his favorite minorities. Actually I have no idea who he would distribute it to. His friends in City Hall are probably a safer bet.

If you compare something Trump maybe said years ago that was not in the best of taste to something bad enough to make you leave your home, I'd say the latter would be more important to most people. Plus, people already KNOW that Trump says stuff that's not in the best of taste. Another spate of news articles about that isn't going to shock anyone who hasn't been living under a rock for the past 3.5 years.
Who is Bill DeBlasio?

https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog/ha ... d-for-all/
I speak of course of the man who in 2001 changed his name to “Bill De Blasio” and who is now mayor of New York City. A modern-day red-diaper baby whose parents were both communists (like him); who left college to help the Nicaraguan communists in the ’80s (proving that he must have been influenced at some point by the Jesuits); who joined the “Nicaraguan Solidarity Movement” that sought to destroy capitalism and replace it with socialism; who honeymooned in Cuba (Bernie Sanders already had done the Russia honeymoon thing); and worked for both Clintons.

The people who elected this numbskull communist as their mayor are now packing up moving vans by the thousands and moving to YOUR city and YOUR state. Good luck with that.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by dualstow » Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:41 am

I Shrugged wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:38 pm
(Lew Rockwell) wrote:
Who is Bill DeBlasio?

I speak of course of the man who in 2001 changed his name to “Bill De Blasio” and who is now mayor of New York City. A modern-day red-diaper baby whose parents were both communists (like him); who left college to help the Nicaraguan communists in the ’80s (proving that he must have been influenced at some point by the Jesuits); who joined the “Nicaraguan Solidarity Movement” that sought to destroy capitalism and replace it with socialism; who honeymooned in Cuba (Bernie Sanders already had done the Russia honeymoon thing); and worked for both Clintons.

The people who elected this numbskull communist as their mayor are now packing up moving vans by the thousands and moving to YOUR city and YOUR state. Good luck with that.
https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog/ha ... d-for-all/
Wow, the story of DeBlasio’s father, linked in the Rockwell piece, is very tragic.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Cortopassi » Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:11 pm

But, but, but, I thought we are buying lots and lots of shiny new aircraft and carriers and bombs? And bullets....guess we were low on bullets too. Bet those are shiny!

In stock!

>:D

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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Cortopassi » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:02 am

Trump is a non-leader. He is a caricature. It's like not being able to stop watching a bad movie because it is so bad. Tell me please, what purpose does this serve?

All of us peons in the country have to live by these distancing and mask rules, rightly or wrongly. For every vote he thinks he'll get from this, I guarantee there is at least one counter vote from a parent who can't send their kids to in person school because we haven't gotten this under control. And he effing flaunts it every chance he gets.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... olina-mask

“You ever see the gyms with the circles?” he said, an apparent reference to a Biden event held in a school gymnasium with attendees observing social distancing guidelines.

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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Kbg » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:24 am

I think the counterpoint is that there are probably just as many Americans who think the other side has way overreacted and it's hard to argue the data is not bearing that out now. The tragedy of this whole thing is how it could have been very different if it wouldn't have been politicized by both parties. Cuomo and Trump I think both get Fs for politicizing it initially...and they both surely did.

You do have to give the man one thing, he knows how to tap into strong undercurrents.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Cortopassi » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:40 am

Kbg wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:24 am
I think the counterpoint is that there are probably just as many Americans who think the other side has way overreacted and it's hard to argue the data is not bearing that out now. The tragedy of this whole thing is how it could have been very different if it wouldn't have been politicized by both parties. Cuomo and Trump I think both get Fs for politicizing it initially...and they both surely did.

You do have to give the man one thing, he knows how to tap into strong undercurrents.
I know this is totally politicized, but who is "the other side?"

I understand technically who that is, a lot of people, but the official line from the government at almost all levels, is wear a mask when appropriate (or mandated), and social distance, right?

And he gives that position the finger every chance he gets. He's like this anti-government candidate, not in office yet, but he IS the government? Isn't this a huge contradiction, or hypocrisy, or irony, some other word like that?

I mean what is going through a Trump supporter's head at a rally? Woo Hoo, this is great, we don't need no stinking masks!!! Rah Rah!

And then they go home, because they have to work from home, because they can't go in the office yet (or don't have a job anymore), and their kids are their with them because they can't go to school yet.

So then they are sitting there, what, stewing because everyone is against Trump and he's right, this virus ain't nothin', why are we doing all this mask and distancing stuff?

But there is no lightbulb that goes off, he IS the government! He's not an outsider anymore! I guess not.

So strange.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Kbg » Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:04 am

The other side is the Democratic party who has not been driven by the science either. (Personally I'll give any government official a pass for not having it figured out in March or April but not after that. It's completely irrational to think that any government or individual has anything complex all figured out on day 1 of a crisis.)

The mask example totally makes my point, because the issue was politicized wearing masks has become politicized...not wearing them is a form of protest. I agree not a helpful form of protest during a pandemic but nonetheless that's what is going on.

And of course he's the anti-government candidate. No big surprise there. He's been that since 2015. I personally happen to think that our best politicians know how to put the politics/political views aside and lead when they have to. Trump I think is incapable of doing that.

However, I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to figure out the mainstream press has been using their reporting on COVID as a weapon. The daily story lines are utterly predictable at this point.

I am grateful for the state I live in. The dominant political culture is moderate right/Republican and the governor and state health leaders have done an outstanding job in my view of balancing the need to have a robust economy and keep the population safe. We have both excellent employment and COVID stats. The main challenge right now is dealing with college related outbreaks and the approach is moderate and sensible...if you got it or are exposed, 14 day quarantine, do classes remotely, come back to classroom instruction when you are out of quarantine. There's been no serious thought of not going to college. Same applies to elementary, middle and high school public education.

I really disagree with people who's default setting is government is bad...what matters is good government
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by WiseOne » Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:06 am

There are plenty of people on the "other side", Cortopassi. Yes there are many who are deathly afraid of contracting COVID because of the steady drumbeat in the news about increasing cases and trumpeted single case reports of people who have died. But as time goes on, this effect is wearing off. People are noticing that the high caseload is not translating to hospitalizations or deaths - as is well described in this video describing what's happening as a "casedemic":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FU3OibcindQ

(I promise it's < 9 minutes.)

People are also smart enough to observe that months of mass gatherings in the form of BLM protests/riots have not had any effect on cases. That's been especially clear in NYC. I did wince at the sight of the RNC convention with a packed audience most of whom were not wearing masks, but in fact it's an excellent test. Let's see how many cases/illnesses arise from that event. If so, they should be evident by now.

While this wearing down effect is going on, people are also seeing up close and personal the results of COVID lockdowns: kids kept out of school, businesses closed, barriers to leaving your house. Many are questioning whether the cost of this is worth it. Then there's the protests, riots, increased crime, and decreased quality of life in the cities. I posted in another thread about how two of my relatives, who have been solid Democratic voters for decades are afraid of what the Democrats are now promoting and are of the opinion that Trump has been a net good, and they plan to vote for him in November. I never said a word and in fact they don't even know what my views are. They volunteered this out of the blue.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Cortopassi » Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:51 am

WiseOne wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:06 am
There are plenty of people on the "other side", Cortopassi. Yes there are many who are deathly afraid of contracting COVID because of the steady drumbeat in the news about increasing cases and trumpeted single case reports of people who have died. But as time goes on, this effect is wearing off. People are noticing that the high caseload is not translating to hospitalizations or deaths - as is well described in this video describing what's happening as a "casedemic":
I watched and agree the goalposts and talking has shifted to cases vs. deaths. It is so frustrating, but you just CAN'T bring that up at any level, because you WILL get your head chewed off by some people who are still terrified. We still get daily updates on the news of IL latest cases and death, and deaths lately have been in single digits for the state, in a state where the average deaths/day last year were about 300.

There are more people who have shifted to the overblown side, but those aren't the people in control.

But after reading the Simon article, with this line sticking out at the end:

"If they acted like it is a crisis then I might believe it is a crisis. Americans are catching on that now this may be more of a big con than the public health crisis we are being told it is."

I just don't think it is going to disappear on Nov 3rd if Biden wins, like some of my more conspiracy minded friends think. I was watching CNN a bit last light (I like Cuomo -- gasp!) and he already had moved on from Trump's handling to complaining on Biden -- what are his plans if he wins? How will he deal with this?

I am also worried about what are seemingly becoming permanent level changes to schools, workplaces, stores, etc. When this burns out or we have a vaccine, are we not going back to 30 kids in a classroom? Drop all the plexiglas that's everywhere? I'm scared we aren't.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Kriegsspiel » Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:10 am

On the other hand, aren't our increasingly sterile environments leading to an increase in allergies/immune system disorders?
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Cortopassi » Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:21 am

MangoMan wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:07 am
Personally, I hope I never have to shake hands with anyone ever again.
I *love* shaking hands when meeting someone. :P

As for # of kids, that was just a statement. 20 is more reasonable, but my concern is more centered on will desks be placed back to normal distances? Will people be able to stand tightly in any kind of lines for anything without freaking? For food, sporting events, etc.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Kriegsspiel » Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:25 am

Speaking of, I just listened to Joel Salatin on JRE, and he was talking the gross things he does to keep his immune system in working order ("I haven't had any kind of illness in 20 years"), like drinking 'clean' (his words) water out of the beef watering trough that they'd been slobbering in, sticking his hands in the compost pile, and eating a bit of dirt with his asparagus that he just harvested out of his garden.

I'll admit I probably eat more dirt than the average American, the backyard garden being to blame, of course.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Kriegsspiel » Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:32 am

Cortopassi wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:21 am
As for # of kids, that was just a statement. 20 is more reasonable, but my concern is more centered on will desks be placed back to normal distances? Will people be able to stand tightly in any kind of lines for anything without freaking? For food, sporting events, etc.
I think people will put it out of mind once the media onslaught abates. Or maybe, as more and more people get fed up and stop clicking on those stories, they'll hit some critical mass and switch to some other type of programming, and then the rest of the people will move past it.

As in, teachers put desks far apart and talk about social distancing at school, but since none of the kids (or the teacher) knows anyone who's died from it, and they don't hear from the media about how someone died from it on the other side of the country last week, they'll just... stop.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Kriegsspiel » Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:35 am

By the way:
Using data on the reopening decisions of 835 public school districts in the United States, we find that school districts in locations with stronger teachers’ unions are less likely to reopen in person even after we control semi-parametrically for differences in local demographic characteristics. These results are robust to four measures of union strength, various potential confounding characteristics, and a further disaggregation to the county level. We also do not find evidence to suggest that measures of COVID-19 risk are correlated with school reopening decisions. link
via Tyler Cowen.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by vnatale » Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:43 pm

Kriegsspiel wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:25 am
Speaking of, I just listened to Joel Salatin on JRE, and he was talking the gross things he does to keep his immune system in working order ("I haven't had any kind of illness in 20 years"), like drinking 'clean' (his words) water out of the beef watering trough that they'd been slobbering in, sticking his hands in the compost pile, and eating a bit of dirt with his asparagus that he just harvested out of his garden.

I'll admit I probably eat more dirt than the average American, the backyard garden being to blame, of course.
I laugh at my friend when she washes what she takes out of my garden. I don't use any pesticides on anything. I generally do not wash what I take out of my garden. It's basically completely organic. All my fertilizer is from leaves on my property.

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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Kbg » Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:13 pm

It will be interesting to see how things change. History shows thing go mostly back to normal with some changes to pre-event norms. I kind of hope we will become a little more Asian with regard to masking when sick (flu/colds). It's not a big deal to do and it does mitigate the spread of aerosol borne pathogens (doesn't prevent). Another nice thing would be if the "norm" became stay home if you are sick vs. spreading your illness to others. My grandparents, who were not yet born but grew up in families hit by the Spanish Flu, definitely "holed up" when they had what they thought was the flu...simply to not spread it to others.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Tortoise » Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:44 pm

Kbg wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:13 pm
I kind of hope we will become a little more Asian with regard to masking when sick (flu/colds).
I can't remember if someone on this forum posted this article a while back (if so, my bad), but I was interested to learn recently that one of the big reasons why mask-wearing became so common in East Asian countries was due to the historical influence of Taoism:
The underlying reason could be philosophical: All three countries [Japan, China, and Korea] have been broadly influenced by Taoism and the health precepts of Traditional Chinese Medicine, in which breath and breathing are seen as a central element in good health. “‘Qi’ is a central concept in Chinese cosmology—and thereby physiology—generally having to do with energy and vapor,” explains Michelle M. Ching, a board certified practitioner of acupuncture and herbal medicine based in Los Angeles. “Qi has numerous meanings in Chinese including ‘air’ [kong qi], ‘atmosphere’ [qi fen], ‘odor’ [qi wei], which is perhaps another reason masks are so necessary in China!, ‘strength’ [li qi] and ‘pathogen’ [xie qi]. When bodily qi is depleted, or its movement deranged, pain and disease develop. So breathing is critical in order to maintain good qi in the body.”

Meanwhile, the intake of “feng,” or noxious wind, is considered the most potent and common of TCM’s “Six External Causes” of disease. “Think about wind,” says Ching. “It can blow open doors, blow cool air off a body of water to the land surrounding it, or fire from one part of the forest to another. The door analogy relates to TCM’s understanding of how exposure to wind can weaken our body’s defenses.”(Perhaps as a permutation of these ideas, East Asia has numerous ancillary superstitions about air and wind, the most notable of which is a deathly fear of sleeping in rooms with running electric fans, a belief that has its epicenter in Korea, where “fan death” phobia remains rampant even today.)

The bottom line is that in East Asia, the predilection toward using face-coverings to prevent exposure to bad air is something that predates the germ theory of disease, and extends into the very foundations of East Asian culture. In recent years, however, mask-wearing has become rooted in new and increasingly postmodern rationales.
https://qz.com/299003/a-quick-history-o ... in-public/

I'm all in favor of America adopting a permanent custom of expecting sick people (those with fevers, coughs, etc.) to wear masks in public if they can't stay home, but the idea that everyone has to wear them -- including healthy people who feel perfectly fine -- seems like extreme overkill to me since masks are more for protecting others, not yourself.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by WiseOne » Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:48 am

Agree, Tortoise!

My colleagues and I have always done this. If I had to work while sick I would put on a mask before going to see a patient. We should do the same for our colleagues. Mask if you’re coughing and have a lower bar for staying home. Nobody likes standing next to a colleague who proudly says they came to work sick. Brownie points for that needs to end.

Keeping in mind that this is worlds away from universal mask mandates. Apart from the numerous studies showing ineffectiveness when used as a public health measure. I wonder why there’s been so little effort put into figuring out precisely the circumstances where people get infected. I’ll bet it’s because there is precious little evidence for casual, transient contact eg walking past someone on a city sidewalk. Even the reports of cases following large events aren’t convincing by themselves, because usually groups of friends or colleagues attend them and they could have spread virus to each other at any time, not just at the large event.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by dualstow » Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:37 am

I’m not sure how Trump is doing, but Tim Pool is right: the rioters may as well be out there campaigning for Trump. The democrats aren't doing enough to stop them. They've gotten me to hate them more than republicans. This is going to make voting for a D or an R very difficult this year.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by shekels » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:58 pm

I saw this quote on another site.
There will be endless smear campaigns and accusations against Trump,
because so many people fall for deception.



"As someone who had severe TDS until June of this year, watching these smear campaigns come out nonstop is insane. I used to fall for them. I believed them. I have posted about how hard it is to pull yourself out of that TDS because you have to admit that you are easily manipulated and you were wrong.

I can finally see how they do it. On the outside looking in now, I compare it to being the sober person in a room with a bunch of drunk people you used to drink with - I’m sure a lot of you know that feeling. They look and act ridiculous, and it’s embarrassing. You want to help them, but they won’t listen.

It is slow and methodical brainwashing. They don’t realize they have been initiated into a cult of lies and propaganda. Again, it is HARD to walk away from that. I have heard it being compared to having to knock down your internal belief system and completely rebuild. That is how it felt for me.

Anyway, my point is - Women for Trump and f*ck your feelings!"
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by flyingpylon » Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:35 pm

Libertarian666 wrote:
Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:15 pm
dualstow wrote:
Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:37 am
I’m not sure how Trump is doing, but Tim Pool is right: the rioters may as well be out there campaigning for Trump. The democrats aren't doing enough to stop them. They've gotten me to hate them more than republicans. This is going to make voting for a D or an R very difficult this year.
You don't have to like Trump.
But if you don't want riots, you have to vote for Trump.
In fact, if you want Western Civilization to survive, you have to vote for Trump.
Those are the stakes.
Curiously, some people seem to think the end of Western Civilization is an acceptable trade-off.
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Re: Is Trump doing a good job?

Post by Tortoise » Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:21 pm

New campaign ad from Trump. Ouch.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1304117520429912064
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