Coronavirus General Discussion

[WiseOne]

Maddy's got it right. The health care system has been so screwed up by Obama's various reforms that it's almost impossible for anything to work as well as it did before he took office. And it's now beyond fixing. Medical centers have spent untold millions on new EHR systems and they're not going to back out of them, plus they've introduced a huge pile of requirements and a large new layer of administrators, none of which would go away even if all the Obama-era regulations vanished tomorrow.

I'm genuinely curious what will happen if there is truly a crisis situation. I suspect there won't be though...it'll be like a second flu season immediately on the heels of the regularly scheduled one. Tough, but manageable. Eventually it will become the new normal, because the virus will be in circulation forever probably.

In other news...several medical centers (mine included) have banned travel to meetings or any gatherings with more than "25-50" people - including events within the university. There are a couple of upcoming meetings & events that I've had to cancel out on. True to form, one of them immediately sent out an announcement that they will not cancel or modify their meeting in any way, which roughly translates as "We have your money, suckas, and you're not getting it back!".

[Kriegsspiel]

Why, with the greatest healthcare system in the world, can the US not have testing kits readily available yet after watching this go on for weeks now in China, S Korea and Italy?

I keep reading it was tried to be made more complicated, there was lab contamination, and agencies can't seem to work together.

This is going to be quite a test of our healthcare system compared to other supposedly inferior ones.

It makes me think that the situation was complicated, if even the most technologically-capable healthcare organizations in world history didn't do it well in retrospect.

<sarcasm> But boy, if we need to 50,000 troops somewhere in a couple days to blow the crap out of something, damn, we are good at that <sarcasm off>

For essentially all of recorded history, military operations have been the purview of government, so this grocks rightly.

[dualstow]

David Faber asked an important question this morning: How do you know when to re-open schools?

[pmward]

In other news...several medical centers (mine included) have banned travel to meetings or any gatherings with more than "25-50" people - including events within the university. There are a couple of upcoming meetings & events that I've had to cancel out on. True to form, one of them immediately sent out an announcement that they will not cancel or modify their meeting in any way, which roughly translates as "We have your money, suckas, and you're not getting it back!".

Yeah my job in the tech industry has the same 20 people limitation. If anyone travels or goes to any function with more than 20 people they are supposed to report it to their manager and potentially be quarantined working from home for 14 days. We also had an in person training last week that was supposed to be a big all in one room affair and they broke us up into small groups of 20 people in different areas.... but the funny thing is every day of the week the cafeteria at around noon has at least 100 people congregated, lol. My teammates in the Kirkland office were also all told to work from home indefinitely.

[Ad Orientem]

Iranian revolutionary guard chief :'Coronavirus may be US bio warfare attack on China and Iran'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ttack.html

[Tortoise]

David Faber asked an important question this morning: How do you know when to re-open schools?

Plot twist: People will discover that their kids are learning more while staying home from school than while attending it, so the schools will never re-open.

[pmward]

In a related note, I had already thought that seeing all these companies shutting down entire office buildings and making people work from home indefinitely might be a turning point where some companies see that they don't need as much big expensive office space and start thinking about ramping up remote work positions so they can close some buildings and save money.

[drumminj]

My teammates in the Kirkland office were also all told to work from home indefinitely.

Yeah, Amazon in Seattle/Bellevue is WFH until end of month. Microsoft until 3/25.

[pmward]

Yeah, I'm actually encouraged seeing companies taking this seriously and not waiting on the government to tell them to take preventative steps like this to contain the spread.

[dualstow]

Just got a Starbucks shareholder notice that there will be no physical shareholder's meeting.
Hey, maybe San Francisco won't be alone with all the cancellations.

[Maddy]

Is your friend ok, Maddy?

Thanks for asking, Dualstow. She's pulled through one surgery and has another scheduled for today. So far so good. She's a tough lady.

And one shining display of functionality this morning: The hospital gift shop was right on top of things!

[dualstow]

I'm glad to hear the gift shop was in good shape.
I'm happy for your friend!

[Tortoise]

In a related note, I had already thought that seeing all these companies shutting down entire office buildings and making people work from home indefinitely might be a turning point where some companies see that they don't need as much big expensive office space and start thinking about ramping up remote work positions so they can close some buildings and save money.

Over the past four years, I’ve worked at two companies where my bosses and many of my teammates have worked in different geographic locations and time zones than mine, and we all often work from home.

I’ve personally found it to be a bad idea. It’s less efficient than having the whole team in the same building together. There’s really no substitute for face-to-face interactions in a team environment.

And for building rapport with colleagues and bosses, you really need frequent physical face time with nonverbal cues. It’s how human cultures evolved, so it’s in our DNA.

[drumminj]

not waiting on the government to tell them

Well, I believe the companies are doing this due to guidance made by the county. But still, I agree it's a good move.

[pmward]

In a related note, I had already thought that seeing all these companies shutting down entire office buildings and making people work from home indefinitely might be a turning point where some companies see that they don't need as much big expensive office space and start thinking about ramping up remote work positions so they can close some buildings and save money.

Over the past four years, I’ve worked at two companies where my bosses and many of my teammates have worked in different geographic locations and time zones than mine, and we all often work from home.

I’ve personally found it to be a bad idea. It’s less efficient than having the whole team in the same building together. There’s really no substitute for face-to-face interactions in a team environment.

And for building rapport with colleagues and bosses, you really need frequent physical face time with nonverbal cues. It’s how human cultures evolved, so it’s in our DNA.

Haha, yeah on my team, even with only like a dozen people, that's not even possible as we have members that are spread out in 4 different locations across the country, haha. I have worked with people every day for years that I've never once met in person. Slack and Zoom help immensely.

[Maddy]

An interesting tidbit: Cloroquine, the old standby drug for treating malaria, is being used with success in the treatment of CoVID-19. Which has led to speculation that plain old quinine water might be of some use. https://www.reddit.com/r/COVID19/commen ... available/ Any gin and tonic fans here?

On another topic, I was just washing vegetables for dinner and wonder what others here do to sanitize fresh produce. My routine during the last few weeks has been to spray with full-strength vinegar, rinse, spray with hydrogen peroxide, rinse again, dab dry, then transfer to a new plastic bag. Any opinions on whether this is sufficient? Overkill?

[Ad Orientem]

Coronavirus in N.Y.: 2,733 People Are Under Quarantines in City
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/05/nyre ... e=Homepage

[dualstow]

An interesting tidbit: Cloroquine, the old standby drug for treating malaria, is being used with success in the treatment of CoVID-19. Which has led to speculation that plain old quinine water might be of some use. https://www.reddit.com/r/COVID19/commen ... available/ Any gin and tonic fans here?

On another topic, I was just washing vegetables for dinner and wonder what others here do to sanitize fresh produce. My routine during the last few weeks has been to spray with full-strength vinegar, rinse, spray with hydrogen peroxide, rinse again, dab dry, then transfer to a new plastic bag. Any opinions on whether this is sufficient? Overkill?

I like gin without the tonic, especially the cocktail known as an aviation. I do like to make tonic water glow, as can be seen in its wiki page. That page also says there’s not much quinine in it these days.

produce: In the early nineties, I used to use the diluted bleach soak solution while overseas. It’s been a long time since I found food-grade bleach. The term even sounds funny now.
I have learned to thoroughly wash something if I’m going to keep the skin on and pierce it, e.g. purple potatoes.
Used to buy special produce wash, but I got lazy.

[Xan]

On another topic, I was just washing vegetables for dinner and wonder what others here do to sanitize fresh produce. My routine during the last few weeks has been to spray with full-strength vinegar, rinse, spray with hydrogen peroxide, rinse again, dab dry, then transfer to a new plastic bag. Any opinions on whether this is sufficient? Overkill?

Holy cow! A quick rinse in the sink is all I've ever done. Or if it's "pre-washed" like a bag of spinach, then it goes straight into the meal.

Am I lucky to be alive?

[dualstow]

LOL!

[Mountaineer]

On another topic, I was just washing vegetables for dinner and wonder what others here do to sanitize fresh produce. My routine during the last few weeks has been to spray with full-strength vinegar, rinse, spray with hydrogen peroxide, rinse again, dab dry, then transfer to a new plastic bag. Any opinions on whether this is sufficient? Overkill?

Holy cow! A quick rinse in the sink is all I've ever done. Or if it's "pre-washed" like a bag of spinach, then it goes straight into the meal.

Am I lucky to be alive?

Image 3-6-20 at 11.02 AM.jpeg (103.43 KiB) Viewed 32174 times

[vnatale]

45,000 deaths already this year in the United States from the annual flu?

I was totally unaware of that. How aware or unaware were you of the magnitude of that stat?

I was aware that in the 60s it seems like that many people a year were getting killed in car accidents but now it's in the 30,000 range (even though far more people and far more miles driven).

During the entire VietNam War about 50,000?

Vinny

[Cortopassi]

45,000 deaths already this year in the United States from the annual flu?

I was totally unaware of that. How aware or unaware were you of the magnitude of that stat?

I was aware that in the 60s it seems like that many people a year were getting killed in car accidents but now it's in the 30,000 range (even though far more people and far more miles driven).

During the entire VietNam War about 50,000?

Vinny

CDC officials do not have exact counts of how many people die from flu each year. Flu is so common that not all flu cases are reported, and flu is not always listed on death certificates. So the CDC uses statistical models, which are periodically revised, to make estimates.

Fatal complications from the flu can include pneumonia, stroke and heart attack.

Take that statement with whatever amount of salt you care to.

[vnatale]

45,000 deaths already this year in the United States from the annual flu?

I was totally unaware of that. How aware or unaware were you of the magnitude of that stat?

I was aware that in the 60s it seems like that many people a year were getting killed in car accidents but now it's in the 30,000 range (even though far more people and far more miles driven).

During the entire VietNam War about 50,000?

Vinny

CDC officials do not have exact counts of how many people die from flu each year. Flu is so common that not all flu cases are reported, and flu is not always listed on death certificates. So the CDC uses statistical models, which are periodically revised, to make estimates.

Fatal complications from the flu can include pneumonia, stroke and heart attack.

Take that statement with whatever amount of salt you care to.

Per what you just wrote, this is what I am seeing there...

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/index.htm

CDC estimates that so far this season there have been at least 34 million flu illnesses, 350,000 hospitalizations and 20,000 deaths from flu.

How far back would we have to go to get to a cumulative 20,000 deaths in our country from plane crashes?

Yet a plane crash gets far more attention. And, which are people more afraid of? Dying in a plane crash or dying from the flu?

I'm still yet to get the first flu shot of my life.

VInny

[Xan]

Still seems to me like flu is something that pushes people who are teetering over the edge, and not much more than that. Am I wrong?