TDS discussion thread

[dualstow]

"Bacillus Anti-Trumpicus" - Funny - Reminded me of the old Wile E. Coyote - Road Runner cartoons.

Road Runner - From Wiki
Wile E. Coyote include Carnivorous slobbius, Eatius birdius, Overconfidentii vulgaris, Poor schinookius, or Caninus nervous rex.[6]

He's the one who got himself elected, so he's the one who gets to define what it means to be "presidential" for this four years. There is no manual of presidentialness stored in the top right desk drawer in the oval office.

I'll let Corto define it his way, but for me it's a nice way of saying he acts like a buffoonish Caligula Vulgaris. Nothing to do with policy, though, and policy is what we should focus on.

[shekels]

For many TDS started with not being "Presidential"
So what is "Presidential"?

Who in the U.S.would fit that criteria?

If being "Presidential" is important to you, are the Views Trump has all that important to you or just a sideshow?
I agree, he can be annoying to People but he is also a hero to people, for saying what they are thinking/believe.

Do People just have hurt feelings by what he says.
or do people hate him for what Trump does.

He is Not Obama. The people that liked Obama are now on the opposite side of the coin were and Vice Versa.

Personally, I Rate Pres Trump on what he accomplishes or doesn't accomplish.

[shekels]

.

Why? Because proponents of leftist ideology have come to the (pretty reasonable) conclusion that the beginning of the Trump era means the end of the socialist era. They realized that it was time to go all in. Otherwise, the idea of turning 50 American states into 50 Soviet socialist republics would fail."

Vinny

I thought it was 57.

Or Sixty States Do I hear Sixty .

Sold to the Socialist in Red.

[Cortopassi]

I don't obsess over his tweets, better to say I am disheartened by them.

He gets blasted by the left, incessantly. Agree.

If I had to pick one thing out of the past 3 years, a few weeks ago he said "I don't take responsibility at all."

Well, then, what good is he? It's always someone else's fault when something doesn't go right. Always. 100%. No exceptions. When stuff goes right, it is always him. 100%.

Bottom line, I am happy to see that my children see him for the narcissist he is. It has to be either his upbringing or something wrong in his mind. In 30 years of working I have only met two other business owners who even come close to his level, and both ended up running their businesses into the ground because they were incapable of listening to advice from other people.

"Narcissticus Tremendius" would be my road runner name for him.

[Mountaineer]

Ps 146:3. Do not trust in princes, In mortal man, in whom there is no salvation.

Once this is taken into the heart and understood, TDS is completely cured, as will be ODS, BDS, or even CDS for those with longer memories. It will even cure news junkies and those who feel compelled to comment on every tweet they find fault with.

[dualstow]

Guys, I only have a single symptom of TDS. The inability to get over his style and lack of "presidentialness"

I have little issue with most of his policies, like I had little issue with most of Obama's.
...
You'd ask then, is his style and manner enough for me to want him out of office simply based off that? You bet.
...

I can understand both Trump's supporters and detractors to some extent. However, if that is your main beef, Corto, wasn't his style and manner apparent when you voted for him the first time around? I don't get that at all.

[Tortoise]

Almost every politician is a narcissist. Trump just doesn't bother trying to hide his narcissism.

"How dare you show people who you really are? Have you no shame, sir?"

[Cortopassi]

Guys, I only have a single symptom of TDS. The inability to get over his style and lack of "presidentialness"

I have little issue with most of his policies, like I had little issue with most of Obama's.
...
You'd ask then, is his style and manner enough for me to want him out of office simply based off that? You bet.
...

I can understand both Trump's supporters and detractors to some extent. However, if that is your main beef, Corto, wasn't his style and manner apparent when you voted for him the first time around? I don't get that at all.

I totally admit, I loved him messing with people, for the most part, when he was campaigning. But like many at the time, we were hoping for a turn to a presidential demeanor when he actually won. That didn't happen, so I, over time, shifted my sentiment.

[GT]

I don't obsess over his tweets, better to say I am disheartened by them.

He gets blasted by the left, incessantly. Agree.

If I had to pick one thing out of the past 3 years, a few weeks ago he said "I don't take responsibility at all."

Well, then, what good is he? It's always someone else's fault when something doesn't go right. Always. 100%. No exceptions. When stuff goes right, it is always him. 100%.

Bottom line, I am happy to see that my children see him for the narcissist he is. It has to be either his upbringing or something wrong in his mind. In 30 years of working I have only met two other business owners who even come close to his level, and both ended up running their businesses into the ground because they were incapable of listening to advice from other people.

"Narcissticus Tremendius" would be my road runner name for him.

Can't say Trump fits the personality I would enjoy being around - would not want to be his boss, employee or neighbor

But then again I would not want to be Biden or Hilary's boss, employee or neighbor

Don't they all have "Narcissticus Tremendius" some just hide it better

[Cortopassi]

"How dare you show people who you really are? Have you no shame, sir?"

We are all the same to some extent. I will say certain things and feel comfortable with close friends, be a bit less open with a wider group, and be very careful when I don't know people.

He lacks that filter. Sometimes it works to his favor. With Trump, you know what's in his mind. I'd rather that be hidden, just like all of us think thoughts multiple times a day that we'd never, ever say out loud.

[Tyler]

Almost every politician is a narcissist. Trump just doesn't bother trying to hide his narcissism.

True. But other recent presidents didn't hide it either. People just chose to ignore it depending on their political preferences.

Obama references himself 392 times in one speech

[Tortoise]

[Trump] lacks that filter. Sometimes it works to his favor.

Yes, and sometimes it works in the American people's favor as well. For example, when Trump puts a nasty reporter or media personality in his or her place, I think it gives a voice to his constituents that they've never really had before. And that new voice makes them feel a bit more empowered.

In other words, I think that lack of a filter cuts both ways. It lets in a lot of embarrassing nonsense, but it also brings a lot of important ideas into the public arena (like the idea that mainstream media may actually be an enemy of the people) that most "filtered" personalities wouldn't dare to broach.

[Cortopassi]

Almost every politician is a narcissist. Trump just doesn't bother trying to hide his narcissism.

True. But other recent presidents didn't hide it either. People just chose to ignore it depending on their political preferences.

Obama references himself 392 times in one speech

I listened to the montage of one of those. https://grabien.com/story.php?id=38185&order=date. It didn't come across as narcissist to me. The first one in this clip was "I've been to Roseburg, Oregon. I want to thank all the first responders..."

[flyingpylon]

TDS is almost entirely based on emotion.

It would be nice to find a President with a perfect blend of style and substance that would accomplish great things while maximizing warm fuzzies and making almost everyone happy.

But sometimes you have to deal with otherwise unsavory characters to get things done.

[Cortopassi]

If I had to pick one thing out of the past 3 years, a few weeks ago he said "I don't take responsibility at all."

because we were given a — a set of circumstances and we were given rules, regulations, and specifications from a different time. It wasn’t meant for this kind of an event with the kind of numbers that we’re talking about.

Ok...maybe...but, they did a pandemic simulation in 2019 that sounds like it very closely mimicked what we are seeing now.

From NYT (the bastion of fake news to some, I know)
--------------------
The White House defended its record, saying it responded to the 2019 exercise with an executive order to improve the availability and quality of flu vaccines, and that it moved early this year to increase funding for the Department of Health and Human Services’ program that focuses on global pandemic threats.

“Any suggestion that President Trump did not take the threat of COVID-19 seriously is false,” said Judd Deere, a White House spokesman.

But officials have declined to say why the administration was so slow to roll out broad testing or to move faster, as the simulations all indicated it should, to urge social distancing and school closings.

Asked at his news briefing on Thursday about the government’s preparedness, Mr. Trump responded: “Nobody knew there would be a pandemic or epidemic of this proportion. Nobody has ever seen anything like this before.”
---------------------
Sounds like deflecting and not taking responsibility.

To me it sounds like someone up there saying nobody knew that anyone would ever actually fire those nuclear missiles. No one has ever seen anything like that before. But I'd suspect a major function of government is to plan for these sorts of things?

[Cortopassi]

I see your side, truly I do.

I only imagine, rightly or wrongly, simply through the use of the English language and a little tact, that someone like Bill Clinton, even if he made ALL the same decisions as Trump, would currently have a 95% approval rating on his handling of this.

That (you can agree with this, or probably not) is squarely Trump's fault. If he turned presidential, there would be a lot fewer things the left could fault him on, even if he did ALL the same exact policy moves over the past three years.

My opinion. Could be totally wrong here.

[Kriegsspiel]

Ohio state legislature representative "says she'll press crimes against humanity charge against Trump over hydroxychloroquine promotion" in The Hague. link



via Tim Pool, who really nails it, as usual.

[vnatale]

For many TDS started with not being "Presidential"
So what is "Presidential"?

Who in the U.S.would fit that criteria?

If being "Presidential" is important to you, are the Views Trump has all that important to you or just a sideshow?
I agree, he can be annoying to People but he is also a hero to people, for saying what they are thinking/believe.

Do People just have hurt feelings by what he says.
or do people hate him for what Trump does.

He is Not Obama. The people that liked Obama are now on the opposite side of the coin were and Vice Versa.

Personally, I Rate Pres Trump on what he accomplishes or doesn't accomplish.

...which does not mean what "they are thinking/believe" is correct.

Vinny

[vnatale]

.

Why? Because proponents of leftist ideology have come to the (pretty reasonable) conclusion that the beginning of the Trump era means the end of the socialist era. They realized that it was time to go all in. Otherwise, the idea of turning 50 American states into 50 Soviet socialist republics would fail."

Vinny

I thought it was 57.

For certain. Rather than acknowledge Trump's daily lies by the minute pull out the old chestnuts of the two misstatements Obama made in eight years.

Of course I'm not that dumb to see the total equivalencies between them.

Vinny

[vnatale]

[Trump] lacks that filter. Sometimes it works to his favor.

Yes, and sometimes it works in the American people's favor as well. For example, when Trump puts a nasty reporter or media personality in his or her place, I think it gives a voice to his constituents that they've never really had before. And that new voice makes them feel a bit more empowered.

In other words, I think that lack of a filter cuts both ways. It lets in a lot of embarrassing nonsense, but it also brings a lot of important ideas into the public arena (like the idea that mainstream media may actually be an enemy of the people) that most "filtered" personalities wouldn't dare to broach.

On the other hand, every time he does that he reminds me of the ever petulant child that he is. So reminds me of the kid who you played with who owned the ball and made it quite clear that if all of us did not play by "his" rules then he was leaving with his ball.

Vinny

[vnatale]

If I had to pick one thing out of the past 3 years, a few weeks ago he said "I don't take responsibility at all."

Here's the whole question and answer. Needless to say, the left has taken that statement out of context, as they always do:

"Q Thank you so much, Mr. President. Dr. Fauci said earlier this week that the lag in testing was, in fact, “a failing.” Do you take responsibility for that?

And when can you guarantee that every single American who needs a test will be able to have a test? What’s the date of that?

THE PRESIDENT: Yeah, no, I don’t take responsibility at all, because we were given a — a set of circumstances and we were given rules, regulations, and specifications from a different time. It wasn’t meant for this kind of an event with the kind of numbers that we’re talking about. And what we’ve done is redesigned it very quickly with the help of the people behind me. And we’re now in very, very strong shape.

I think we’ll be announcing, as I said, Sunday night, and this will start very quickly. And we — we’ll have — we’ll have the ability to do in the millions over a very, very quick period of time. So, no.

And what we have done — and we are going to be leaving a very indelible print for the future, in case something like this happens again. But it was a — and that’s not the fault of anybody. And, frankly, the old system worked very well for smaller numbers — much smaller numbers — but not for these kind of numbers."

from https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-st ... ference-3/

Again today he says "we inherited a broken system". Have we once heard everything that he has done in the 3+ years that they have had to fix this "broken system".

When did this virus became known? December? And, we even had a CDC person in China at the time? Yet still holding rallies last month??!!

"I take no responsibility"??!!

Vinny

[vnatale]

If I had to pick one thing out of the past 3 years, a few weeks ago he said "I don't take responsibility at all."

because we were given a — a set of circumstances and we were given rules, regulations, and specifications from a different time. It wasn’t meant for this kind of an event with the kind of numbers that we’re talking about.

Ok...maybe...but, they did a pandemic simulation in 2019 that sounds like it very closely mimicked what we are seeing now.

From NYT (the bastion of fake news to some, I know)
--------------------
The White House defended its record, saying it responded to the 2019 exercise with an executive order to improve the availability and quality of flu vaccines, and that it moved early this year to increase funding for the Department of Health and Human Services’ program that focuses on global pandemic threats.

“Any suggestion that President Trump did not take the threat of COVID-19 seriously is false,” said Judd Deere, a White House spokesman.

But officials have declined to say why the administration was so slow to roll out broad testing or to move faster, as the simulations all indicated it should, to urge social distancing and school closings.

Asked at his news briefing on Thursday about the government’s preparedness, Mr. Trump responded: “Nobody knew there would be a pandemic or epidemic of this proportion. Nobody has ever seen anything like this before.”
---------------------
Sounds like deflecting and not taking responsibility.

To me it sounds like someone up there saying nobody knew that anyone would ever actually fire those nuclear missiles. No one has ever seen anything like that before. But I'd suspect a major function of government is to plan for these sorts of things?

He curtailed travel from China on January 31st and was rewarded by being called a xenophobe. I can only imagine what would have happened if he had acted more swiftly to urge social distancing and the like: "Fear monger! Hysterical over-reaction!" and the like.

I'd also remind you that in our federal system, it is primarily up to the states to prepare for their own health emergencies. And I guess I shouldn't be surprised that the same people who called him a dictator, Hitler, and many other similar names are now upset that he isn't ordering people around strongly enough for them.

And, exactly what else did he do? Again, this seems to be the only act he did that continually gets trotted out. And, it's not even true. How many Americans were allowed to come back to this country from China after he supposedly " curtailed travel from China on January 31st"?

Vinny

[Tyler]

Ohio state legislature representative "says she'll press crimes against humanity charge against Trump over hydroxychloroquine promotion" in The Hague. link



via Tim Pool, who really nails it, as usual.

Yikes. That's truly insane.

To cleanse the palate:

Detroit rep says hydroxychloroquine, Trump helped save her life amid COVID-19 fight


Luckily there are still good people out there willing to be normal human beings without viewing everything through the lens of partisan politics.

[Dieter]

I see your side, truly I do.

I only imagine, rightly or wrongly, simply through the use of the English language and a little tact, that someone like Bill Clinton, even if he made ALL the same decisions as Trump, would currently have a 95% approval rating on his handling of this.

That (you can agree with this, or probably not) is squarely Trump's fault. If he turned presidential, there would be a lot fewer things the left could fault him on, even if he did ALL the same exact policy moves over the past three years.

My opinion. Could be totally wrong here.

Republicans, Fox, and the business community would be all over a Democrat pushing some of these policies / results.

Huge deficit in a booming economy.
Anti business tarriffs / trade wars.
Fewer arrests on the border (first year)
Slowed job creation (first two year less than Obama's last two)
Soft on Crime (First step act)
Iran and Syria / abandoning the Kurds
Hadn't improved or replaced ACA
(Doesn't even have a plan to improve -- will work on that after it's repealed; he promised insurance for everybody)

And that's leaving out Democrats attacking expansion of fossil fuel, loosening of corporate oversight, loosening of environmental regulations, less investment in renewable energy, and lots of the other things Trump is doing.

Leaving it Coronavirus response.

[GT]

"Cortopassi wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 06, 2020 8:46 pm

I only imagine, rightly or wrongly, simply through the use of the English language and a little tact, that someone like Bill Clinton, even if he made ALL the same decisions as Trump, would currently have a 95% approval rating on his handling of this."

I can see this being directional true of 65 to 75% approval rating

Even if Trump was as smooth a talker as Bill Clinton, I doubt it would ever get to 95%. - just my guess