Reasons why I will not be getting injected for the Wuhan

[Cortopassi]

In the 1950's couldn't the argument have been made that the long term effects of the Polio vaccine were not known, and Polio while serious, affected only a relatively small % of Americans, so why take the vaccine? Why subject yourself to a grand experiment?

I went back and looked specifically at the polio vaccine. See the post here (viewtopic.php?f=9&t=11941&p=223941&hilit=polio#p223941)

Anti-vax sentiment from some segments rivaled, easily, what we hear here and elsewhere. Seems history repeats a lot.

[glennds]

In the 1950's couldn't the argument have been made that the long term effects of the Polio vaccine were not known, and Polio while serious, affected only a relatively small % of Americans, so why take the vaccine? Why subject yourself to a grand experiment?

I went back and looked specifically at the polio vaccine. See the post here

Anti-vax sentiment from some segments rivaled, easily, what we hear here and elsewhere. Seems history repeats a lot.

Right. And now that we have enough history in the rear view mirror, can we make a conclusion about the position that the Murder Inc. anti-vax crowd from that time took?
It seems like they all eventually became pretty quiet. But boy, for a while, they were certain, weren't they?

[vnatale]

In the 1950's couldn't the argument have been made that the long term effects of the Polio vaccine were not known, and Polio while serious, affected only a relatively small % of Americans, so why take the vaccine? Why subject yourself to a grand experiment?

I went back and looked specifically at the polio vaccine. See the post here

Anti-vax sentiment from some segments rivaled, easily, what we hear here and elsewhere. Seems history repeats a lot.

Right. And now that we have enough history in the rear view mirror, can we make a conclusion about the position that the Murder Inc. anti-vax crowd from that time took?
It seems like they all eventually became pretty quiet. But boy, for a while, they were certain, weren't they?

JUST as certain as those who believed that the virus would be in the deep past as soon as the election was over in November.

[mathjak107]

Or the virus was not going to be an American problem when it surfaced ...I still remember our first case in ny in westchester and we all went MEH..

[I Shrugged]

Two things that can be true at once are that the polio vaccine was feared but turned out safe, and the current one is feared and turns out to be bad.

I hope not.

[mathjak107]

Or They both are safe and once again the conspiracy, doomsayer ,glass is always empty crowd is wrong again

[murphy_p_t]

Religious Faith versus logic and reason, distilled in the previous two posts.

[mathjak107]

Well scratch religious faith for me .. I have none ..just logic and reason

[vnatale]

Or They both are safe and once again the conspiracy, doomsayer ,glass is always empty crowd is wrong again

I AM with you are this one!

[vnatale]

More on what it will mean to be or be not vaccinated...

Vinny

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics ... uxbndlbing

‘Vaccine passports’ are on the way, but developing them won’t be easy

[mathjak107]

Well they can always just infect each other and try it themselves to see their own outcomes. Or they can spend time over and over on testing site lines chatting with each other trying to do things the vaccinated can just do

[murphy_p_t]

Cool bro. More vindictiveness

[murphy_p_t]

Is "karen" a unisex term?

[mathjak107]

Cool bro. More vindictiveness

That is fact ..

What do you think unvaccinated people with covid will do to each other?

The same is true if exelsior is implemented fully

[I Shrugged]

Or They both are safe and once again the conspiracy, doomsayer ,glass is always empty crowd is wrong again

That's fine. You represent the authoritarian crowd. You've made that clear.

[WiseOne]

Kinda wondering how anyone can be required to get an experimental treatment.

It would never stand up to a court challenge, as long as the judges adhere to the law and don't subscribe to judicial activism.

It will be another 2 years at least before full FDA approval even begins to be possible, because that's how long it will take to complete the Phase 3 clinical trials.

Also interesting that NYC now would require you to carry a smartphone, since the vaccine passport is a phone app. Many people don't have smartphones, and - you guessed it - race & minority status is a rather large determinant. Oh I can't wait!!!

[Xan]

Or They both are safe and once again the conspiracy, doomsayer ,glass is always empty crowd is wrong again

That's fine. You represent the authoritarian crowd. You've made that clear.

I wouldn't say it's authoritarian to hold the position that the vaccines are safe (or at least safer than the disease) and to debunk the facts and figures from the antivax crowd. It's definitely authoritarian to go into full "mark of the beast" mode, requiring passports to live your life.

[WiseOne]

Or They both are safe and once again the conspiracy, doomsayer ,glass is always empty crowd is wrong again

That's fine. You represent the authoritarian crowd. You've made that clear.

I wouldn't say it's authoritarian to hold the position that the vaccines are safe (or at least safer than the disease) and to debunk the facts and figures from the antivax crowd.

I think where the "authoritarian" part comes in is when journalists with no medical credentials whatsoever, and without examining the data, assert in news articles that the vaccine is safe and immediately dismiss any evidence to the contrary. Then they assert that you are a "denier" or "vaccine hesistant" if you examine the data for yourself and come to a different conclusion, or assess your own risk/benefit ratio and come to a decision that is contrary to the mandate you've been given. And if you post any of this analysis on Youtube or Twitter, your content gets deleted and your account may be locked.

What about that isn't authoritarian? Notice by the way that the exact same procedure was applied to the claims of voting irregularities in the 2020 election. There may well have been a perfectly legitimate election but I don't like the way the reports of pretty obvious irregularities were dismissed out of hand.

[Smith1776]

Since Bill Gates is chipping us with the vaccine will I get free Microsoft Office for life?

[Xan]

Or They both are safe and once again the conspiracy, doomsayer ,glass is always empty crowd is wrong again

That's fine. You represent the authoritarian crowd. You've made that clear.

I wouldn't say it's authoritarian to hold the position that the vaccines are safe (or at least safer than the disease) and to debunk the facts and figures from the antivax crowd.

I think where the "authoritarian" part comes in is when journalists with no medical credentials whatsoever, and without examining the data, assert in news articles that the vaccine is safe and immediately dismiss any evidence to the contrary. Then they assert that you are a "denier" or "vaccine hesistant" if you examine the data for yourself and come to a different conclusion, or assess your own risk/benefit ratio and come to a decision that is contrary to the mandate you've been given. And if you post any of this analysis on Youtube or Twitter, your content gets deleted and your account may be locked.

What about that isn't authoritarian? Notice by the way that the exact same procedure was applied to the claims of voting irregularities in the 2020 election. There may well have been a perfectly legitimate election but I don't like the way the reports of pretty obvious irregularities were dismissed out of hand.

Yes, certainly that is authoritarian. Has mathjak advocated that?

[murphy_p_t]

This looks to be a rather complete and compelling indictment against the vaccine salesman, posted only for reason- and evidence-based investigation. Karl denninger, take it away...

https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=241875

[murphy_p_t]

WiseOne

+1 on your comments regarding authoritarian movement.

Regarding skepticism about the rapidity of implementation of vaccine passports....

I see the authoritarianism you highlight.... And extrapolate onto passports and worse. The courts have proven themselves to be illegitimate sophists. For ex, They colluded in suppressing any investigation of the fraudulent election results.

[I Shrugged]

I'd like to remind people that skepticism is an important part of scientific discovery. After all, we all know the earth is flat because all the smart people say so! Never mind that it is also in their own best interest to say it.

Anyway, here is a tweet, that got tagged by Twitter, by infectious disease epidemiologist Martin Kulldorff of Harvard Medical School :

"Thinking that everyone must be vaccinated is as scientifically flawed as thinking that nobody should. COVID vaccines are important for older high-risk people, and their care-takers. Those with prior natural infection do not need it. Nor children."

But no, we should forcibly hold down people and inject them for the good of everyone! Or at least, make sure that anyone who doesn't get vaccinated is treated like a sex offender. Authoritarians are running the country. To say I dislike them would be putting it mildly. In their view, every thing is binary: Either you must do it, or you are not allowed to do it. That is it.

[glennds]

I see the authoritarianism you highlight.... And extrapolate onto passports and worse. The courts have proven themselves to be illegitimate sophists. For ex, They colluded in suppressing any investigation of the fraudulent election results.

Boy you are right about that. The courts are a complete pain in the ass. Half the time, they never say what we want them to say.
Then they throw up all these red herring obstacles like evidence, procedure, legitimate basis, credentials, yada, yada, yada.

[murphy_p_t]

Nah... Handing down decisions without considering evidence, based upon prejudicial decision making... Hiding behind specious arguments to justify political agendas. Or just dismissing cases out of hand, when examining facts is too inconvenient.

Zero integrity.

Zero respect.

Zero credibility.