Safe Deposit Box Location

Other discussions not related to the Permanent Portfolio

Moderator: Global Moderator

User avatar
Cortopassi
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 2770
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:28 pm
Location: Illinois

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Cortopassi » Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:03 pm

hardlawjockey wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 pm
When I started the PP and bought my first set of gold coins I had to decide where to store it and it all boiled down to 3 options ...

1. Bank (or some other entity) safe deposit box
2. A home safe
3. Cleverly hide where nobody will normally look.

Ultimately I chose option #3. My reasoning was that options #1 and #2 are only giving you a false sense of security. The linked article explains why option #1 doesn't work perfectly. With option #2, if burglars invade your home and find a safe they will rightly assume there is something valuable inside of it. With option #3 however, you aren't advertising the presence of your gold and it just seems far less likely that it will ever be found.

That's my logic any way. You are all free to poke holes in it.
I agree with #3, but I will never have the balls to do it. Gold needs to be under some kind of lock and key to me, even if a hidden in a toilet tank, behind a fake wall plate, etc. likely would work just as well.

I also like the idea that most safes offer some level of fire protection, so if your house burns down, they might make it more intact.
User avatar
Xan
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 3277
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:51 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Xan » Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:19 pm

hardlawjockey wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 pm
When I started the PP and bought my first set of gold coins I had to decide where to store it and it all boiled down to 3 options ...

1. Bank (or some other entity) safe deposit box
2. A home safe
3. Cleverly hide where nobody will normally look.

Ultimately I chose option #3. My reasoning was that options #1 and #2 are only giving you a false sense of security. The linked article explains why option #1 doesn't work perfectly. With option #2, if burglars invade your home and find a safe they will rightly assume there is something valuable inside of it. With option #3 however, you aren't advertising the presence of your gold and it just seems far less likely that it will ever be found.

That's my logic any way. You are all free to poke holes in it.
I lost all my gold in a boating accident, but I would seriously consider diversifying, and splitting it among those three.
User avatar
eufo
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 243
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2016 7:17 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by eufo » Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:20 pm

I've been contemplating this subject a lot lately since moving into more physical gold from paper.

I think the idea of diversifying locations and methods is likely the route with the least potential for being ruined. Safe deposit boxes can be drilled, confiscated, or become unavailable in a crisis. Home safes can be stolen or opened through coercion. Hidden spots can be forgotten when moving, accidentally found by the wrong party, or even thrown out.

Multiple locations in the home and at least one location (preferably more) outside of the home seems prudent. None is guaranteed, but a good mix should protect against a total loss.
Don't agree with me too strongly or I'm going to change my mind
boglerdude
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 711
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2016 1:40 am
Contact:

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by boglerdude » Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:32 am

A few coins on hand in case of emergency. . .in case you need to barter your way out of the country?

If people stop using dollars for transactions you're better off with food, water, weapons

For investment amounts...Im thinking Perth mint ETF when its out. Whats the risk, hacks? Bail-ins? Any precedents for those sorts of disasters?
User avatar
Mountaineer
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4353
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2012 10:54 am

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Mountaineer » Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:02 am

Store it in a vat of aqua regia. I was trying to think outside the box. 8) http://www.metalminemedia.com/2013/03/g ... regia.html
The darkness will always war against the light. And the light must always war against the darkness. You either let the darkness overcome you, or you overcome the darkness. The mission: Whatever darkness, compromise, or ungodly thing still exists in your life, no matter how small, today, root it out. There is no middle ground.
User avatar
Desert
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 3233
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 2:39 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Desert » Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:29 pm

Mountaineer wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:02 am
Store it in a vat of aqua regia. I was trying to think outside the box. 8) http://www.metalminemedia.com/2013/03/g ... regia.html
A solution (pun intended) that only a ChemE could love. ;)
User avatar
ochotona
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 3214
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 5:54 am

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by ochotona » Fri Jul 27, 2018 2:11 pm

I use the vault at a locally owned community bank out in a rural part of Texas.
hardlawjockey
Full Member
Full Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:30 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by hardlawjockey » Fri Jul 27, 2018 3:07 pm

Xan wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:19 pm
hardlawjockey wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 pm
When I started the PP and bought my first set of gold coins I had to decide where to store it and it all boiled down to 3 options ...

1. Bank (or some other entity) safe deposit box
2. A home safe
3. Cleverly hide where nobody will normally look.

Ultimately I chose option #3. My reasoning was that options #1 and #2 are only giving you a false sense of security. The linked article explains why option #1 doesn't work perfectly. With option #2, if burglars invade your home and find a safe they will rightly assume there is something valuable inside of it. With option #3 however, you aren't advertising the presence of your gold and it just seems far less likely that it will ever be found.

That's my logic any way. You are all free to poke holes in it.
I lost all my gold in a boating accident, but I would seriously consider diversifying, and splitting it among those three.
My diversification consists of ETF's and about a year's worth of living expenses in #3. Probably won't be buying any more physical gold.

Not sure which of those two is the safest but I don't spend much time worrying about it.
bedraggled
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 704
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 4:20 am

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by bedraggled » Fri Jul 27, 2018 3:15 pm

Ocho, does a community bank in a rural area give a feeling of security? I have a good safe deposit box situation but I wonder now after reading this thread.
User avatar
ochotona
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 3214
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 5:54 am

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by ochotona » Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:04 pm

I know the staff by name, so I believe they'd let me in to empty my box in advance of any emergency banking system shutdown. The contents are insured also.
bedraggled
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 704
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 4:20 am

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by bedraggled » Fri Jul 27, 2018 9:06 pm

Thanks. My box may not be as well situated.
User avatar
Mountaineer
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 4353
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2012 10:54 am

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Mountaineer » Sat Jul 28, 2018 10:05 am

ochotona wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 2:11 pm
I use the vault at a locally owned community bank out in a rural part of Texas.
Oh what the addition of a u and and an l do to a perfectly good storage solution. ;)
The darkness will always war against the light. And the light must always war against the darkness. You either let the darkness overcome you, or you overcome the darkness. The mission: Whatever darkness, compromise, or ungodly thing still exists in your life, no matter how small, today, root it out. There is no middle ground.
User avatar
Ad Orientem
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 3483
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2011 2:47 pm
Location: Florida USA
Contact:

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Ad Orientem » Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:04 pm

Everybody has their anecdotal horror stories. But what you want to look at are statistical probabilities. There is no 100% guaranteed safe form of storage, but a safe deposit box is in almost all circumstances going to be safer than any form of home storage. I don't care how bad ass your home safe is, when they have a gun to your daughter's head and tell you to open the safe, well that's what you are going to do. Keeping any substantial stockpile of gold/silver/cash around the house is a really bad idea. Do things sometimes go wrong with safe deposit boxes? Yes. What is the realistic level of danger? Not enough for me to lose sleep over it. That said I do check every six months or so, just to be sure. Could the planet lose all electric power from some freak solar event? Yes. But from a statistical point of view you would be better of spending your time planning how to spend/invest your powerball winnings.
hardlawjockey
Full Member
Full Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:30 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by hardlawjockey » Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:48 pm

Ad Orientem wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:04 pm
I don't care how bad ass your home safe is, when they have a gun to your daughter's head and tell you to open the safe, well that's what you are going to do. Keeping any substantial stockpile of gold/silver/cash around the house is a really bad idea.
This is basically why I decided against a home safe of any kind. I even thought about employing a "fake safe" filled with washers to sound like coins along with worthless paper, but that presents the same problem as a real safe. You are still advertising the presence of valuables. If the burglars figure out your deception they are going to ask "okay, where is the real safe?".

I still think "hiding in plain site" without a safe is a safer alternative. I don't see how there could ever be any statistics to prove me right or wrong but I tend to think that you would be far less likely to have your gold stolen this way, as long as you keep it its presence a secret.

Obviously you don't want to store it on a boat that can sink, however (though apparently some people here have).
User avatar
ochotona
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 3214
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 5:54 am

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by ochotona » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:13 pm

Ad Orientem wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:04 pm
Everybody has their anecdotal horror stories. But what you want to look at are statistical probabilities. There is no 100% guaranteed safe form of storage, but a safe deposit box is in almost all circumstances going to be safer than any form of home storage. I don't care how bad ass your home safe is, when they have a gun to your daughter's head and tell you to open the safe, well that's what you are going to do. Keeping any substantial stockpile of gold/silver/cash around the house is a really bad idea. Do things sometimes go wrong with safe deposit boxes? Yes. What is the realistic level of danger? Not enough for me to lose sleep over it. That said I do check every six months or so, just to be sure. Could the planet lose all electric power from some freak solar event? Yes. But from a statistical point of view you would be better of spending your time planning how to spend/invest your powerball winnings.
Very unlikely to lose anything from a SDB, and you can insure the loss! 100% certainty of no loss then. Between Chappell Hill Bank, Delaware Depository, I don't lose any sleep. But I can't forgot that boating accident when I lost all the rest of my gold in Loch Ness, Scotland.
User avatar
eufo
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 243
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2016 7:17 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by eufo » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:37 pm

ochotona wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:13 pm
But I can't forgot that boating accident when I lost all the rest of my gold in Loch Ness, Scotland.
You too? That place is cursed. O0
Don't agree with me too strongly or I'm going to change my mind
User avatar
Xan
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 3277
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:51 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Xan » Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:14 pm

ochotona wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:13 pm
Very unlikely to lose anything from a SDB, and you can insure the loss! 100% certainty of no loss then. Between Chappell Hill Bank, Delaware Depository, I don't lose any sleep. But I can't forgot that boating accident when I lost all the rest of my gold in Loch Ness, Scotland.
Insuring a safe deposit box, in addition to greatly increasing the carrying cost of gold, seems to defeat some of the advantages of gold, namely:

* It's entirely outside The System (TM)
* You don't tell anyone you have it
* If you're inclined to take advantage of it (which I am not) there may not be a practical way for government to enforce the paying of taxes on gains

Also, I wonder about the practicality of insurance. It seems that in almost every case, there would be some reason for the insurer to deny your claim. I suppose if a hurricane destroys the bank completely, it's pretty unambiguous. But no matter what, you can't prove that you didn't just take the gold out. And in a situation like the article I linked to earlier, when the bank is claiming that proper notification was done, would insurance actually pay out?

I guess I would like to see some documentation, and some statistics, of insurance actually paying out for a safe deposit box problem. Because I'm basically skeptical that it ever happens.
User avatar
dualstow
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 11627
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:18 am
Contact:

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by dualstow » Wed Aug 01, 2018 8:29 am

My dad has a large old safe where I keep my few coins that are not at the bank.
Once it broke and he had to call the company to come fix it. That made me nervous.
...Zerohedge...
Tyler wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:52 pm
...
Ok -- which one of you guys is Tyler Durden? >:D
MachineGhost, of course!
The annual inflation rate for the United States is 1.4% for the 12 months ended January 2021
Jack Jones
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 268
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2015 3:12 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Jack Jones » Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:45 pm

hardlawjockey wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:48 pm
I even thought about employing a "fake safe" filled with washers to sound like coins along with worthless paper, but that presents the same problem as a real safe. You are still advertising the presence of valuables. If the burglars figure out your deception they are going to ask "okay, where is the real safe?".
You want to put some valuables in your fake safe so when you open it the burglars are satisfied. A friend who went to school in a bad part of town used to do this. He had a fake wallet w/ $40 in it.
hardlawjockey wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:48 pm
I still think "hiding in plain site" without a safe is a safer alternative. I don't see how there could ever be any statistics to prove me right or wrong but I tend to think that you would be far less likely to have your gold stolen this way, as long as you keep it its presence a secret.
I'm not trying to be a dick, but you're not keeping its presence a secret if you advertise on the internet that you're hiding gold in your house. You went to Harvard Law school apparently and your IP address (City, State) is associated to this account. I doubt there are many Harvard grads in your area. At this point, it might be prudent to check out options #1 and #2.
hardlawjockey
Full Member
Full Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:30 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by hardlawjockey » Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:55 pm

Jack Jones wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:45 pm
hardlawjockey wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:48 pm
I even thought about employing a "fake safe" filled with washers to sound like coins along with worthless paper, but that presents the same problem as a real safe. You are still advertising the presence of valuables. If the burglars figure out your deception they are going to ask "okay, where is the real safe?".
You want to put some valuables in your fake safe so when you open it the burglars are satisfied. A friend who went to school in a bad part of town used to do this. He had a fake wallet w/ $40 in it.
hardlawjockey wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:48 pm
I still think "hiding in plain site" without a safe is a safer alternative. I don't see how there could ever be any statistics to prove me right or wrong but I tend to think that you would be far less likely to have your gold stolen this way, as long as you keep it its presence a secret.
I'm not trying to be a dick, but you're not keeping its presence a secret if you advertise on the internet that you're hiding gold in your house. You went to Harvard Law school apparently and your IP address (City, State) is associated to this account. I doubt there are many Harvard grads in your area. At this point, it might be prudent to check out options #1 and #2.
That's pretty cool that you think my username indicates I went to Harvard Law School. I never even thought of that, but I could be lying to keep my identity from being exposed.

Actually, it has something in common with "CrawlingRoad" but I probably shouldn't say that in case genius home burglars are listening and manage to figure it out.
User avatar
Desert
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 3233
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 2:39 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Desert » Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:04 pm

I thought everyone was aware that hardlaw is a professor at Liberty University.
hardlawjockey
Full Member
Full Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:30 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by hardlawjockey » Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:11 pm

Desert wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:04 pm
I thought everyone was aware that hardlaw is a professor at Liberty University.
OMFG! Now I really do have to hide my gold.
User avatar
Desert
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 3233
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 2:39 pm

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by Desert » Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:57 pm

hardlawjockey wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:11 pm
Desert wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:04 pm
I thought everyone was aware that hardlaw is a professor at Liberty University.
OMFG! Now I really do have to hide my gold.
O0
User avatar
dualstow
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 11627
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:18 am
Contact:

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by dualstow » Fri Aug 03, 2018 5:45 pm

Clearly, it’s an anagram for “my gold is in my underpants drawer.”
The annual inflation rate for the United States is 1.4% for the 12 months ended January 2021
User avatar
dualstow
Executive Member
Executive Member
Posts: 11627
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:18 am
Contact:

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Post by dualstow » Fri Aug 03, 2018 5:51 pm

Or Howard something.
The annual inflation rate for the United States is 1.4% for the 12 months ended January 2021
Post Reply