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Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 12:36 pm
by stuper1
Is there any reason to think that a safe deposit box in a local credit union would be better or worse than one in a regular multi-state bank? I keep my physical gold in a safe deposit box (currently at a bank but could switch to a credit union if warranted).

One scenario that concerns me is if say there is a solar flare that knocks out electricity for months on end. This means no computer servers, so no access to stock/bond holdings. Obviously, we would all be in a world of hurt just in terms of avoiding starvation. My hope would be that the provider of my safe deposit box would be able to let me in at some point even if their power were off. Is there any reason to think that this would be more/less likely for a credit union versus a bank?

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 12:57 pm
by pugchief
If the safe deposit box is in a vault, which is usually the case, electricity may be required to open/lock it.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 1:06 pm
by stuper1
The safe deposit box is currently in a vault, and I wouldn't have it any other way. I would hope that there is a way to manually open the vault even without electricity, but that may not be the case.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu May 17, 2018 1:33 pm
by jhogue
I think the simplest thing you might do is to ask your local bank manager to explain what their contingency plan is for the kind of emergency you described.

I had an interesting conversation somewhat along those lines with my local bank manager two years ago when they physically re-located my particular bank branch about a mile down the road from their old location to a newly constructed building. He explained in great detail how the safe deposit boxes would be removed by designated sections and transported from the old to the new location by contracted Brinks armored cars. His explanation of the details convinced me the bank had carefully planned and could successfully execute the operation.

By the way, the scenario you described is part of the reason I always keep a stash of greenbacks (Federal Reserve Notes) and bigger stash of paper I bonds (issued by the U.S. Treasury) along with some physical gold in my local bank safe deposit box. It's also another good reason to use a local bank (or credit union) and get to know the manager on a first name basis. All kinds of disasters happen all the time (eg., the hurricane in Puerto Rico) that might interfere with normal everyday banking. A local bank- particularly one that survived the bank runs of the 1929 Crash and Great Depression-- has every incentive to be prepared for the unexpected.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Sat May 19, 2018 7:11 pm
by Mark Leavy
Think about other secure storage options with 24 hour access. I.e. wine vaults, etc.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:46 pm
by Xan
So a bunch of people's Bank of America safe deposit boxes just... vanished. That's pretty scary from a perspective of putting your gold there.
https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2018/07 ... n-drilled/

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:14 pm
by Cortopassi
Xan wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:46 pm
So a bunch of people's Bank of America safe deposit boxes just... vanished. That's pretty scary from a perspective of putting your gold there.
https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2018/07 ... n-drilled/
Damn. Anyone ever consider, or have, one of those Costco (or other) 700lb+ safes installed in their house?

https://www.costco.com/Cannon-43.8-Cu-F ... 41405.html

I figure you go one of two routes 1) Get one that is so big a burglar just looks at it and goes elsewhere or 2) a smaller well hidden one.

This sure is an interesting use for one!

Image

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:17 pm
by Xan
Cortopassi wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:14 pm
Xan wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:46 pm
So a bunch of people's Bank of America safe deposit boxes just... vanished. That's pretty scary from a perspective of putting your gold there.
https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2018/07 ... n-drilled/
Damn. Anyone ever consider, or have, one of those Costco (or other) 700lb+ safes installed in their house?

https://www.costco.com/Cannon-43.8-Cu-F ... 41405.html

I figure you go one of two routes 1) Get one that is so big a burglar just looks at it and goes elsewhere or 2) a smaller well hidden one.
Maybe the real answer is one of each. For the big safe, I'd want one that was drilled into the foundation. But the big safe is always vulnerable to coercion.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:26 pm
by Cortopassi
Xan wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:17 pm
Cortopassi wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:14 pm
Xan wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:46 pm
So a bunch of people's Bank of America safe deposit boxes just... vanished. That's pretty scary from a perspective of putting your gold there.
https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2018/07 ... n-drilled/
Damn. Anyone ever consider, or have, one of those Costco (or other) 700lb+ safes installed in their house?

https://www.costco.com/Cannon-43.8-Cu-F ... 41405.html

I figure you go one of two routes 1) Get one that is so big a burglar just looks at it and goes elsewhere or 2) a smaller well hidden one.
Maybe the real answer is one of each. For the big safe, I'd want one that was drilled into the foundation. But the big safe is always vulnerable to coercion.
$1500 used ($700 to ship), 4500 pounds, TL-30 burglar rated. I want one. :)

https://www.amazon.com/King-Richard-Mod ... ords=tl-30

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:52 pm
by Tyler
Xan wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:46 pm
So a bunch of people's Bank of America safe deposit boxes just... vanished. That's pretty scary from a perspective of putting your gold there.
https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2018/07 ... n-drilled/

Here's the closing line of the same article discussed by Zerohedge.
So for all those readers who still hold gold in a bank vault, confident it will be there come rain or shine, now may be a time to quietly take it all out and have a small boating accident...
Ok -- which one of you guys is Tyler Durden? >:D

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:54 pm
by Desert
Cortopassi wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:26 pm
Xan wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:17 pm
Cortopassi wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:14 pm


Damn. Anyone ever consider, or have, one of those Costco (or other) 700lb+ safes installed in their house?

https://www.costco.com/Cannon-43.8-Cu-F ... 41405.html

I figure you go one of two routes 1) Get one that is so big a burglar just looks at it and goes elsewhere or 2) a smaller well hidden one.
Maybe the real answer is one of each. For the big safe, I'd want one that was drilled into the foundation. But the big safe is always vulnerable to coercion.
$1500 used ($700 to ship), 4500 pounds, TL-30 burglar rated. I want one. :)

https://www.amazon.com/King-Richard-Mod ... ords=tl-30
That's a pretty good price for a TL30 safe of that size. One challenge is installation. I had a smaller TL30 safe at a former residence, but it still weighed about the same as my car. Experienced safe crews can move them into place, bolt them down, etc., but you have to pay for that. I wouldn't go with any rating less than a TL30 though, for a significant stash of gold.

As Xan pointed out, the biggest risk is probably robbery. The only "solution" to that is complete secrecy, which is hard when a crew of safe movers comes over to the house.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 pm
by hardlawjockey
When I started the PP and bought my first set of gold coins I had to decide where to store it and it all boiled down to 3 options ...

1. Bank (or some other entity) safe deposit box
2. A home safe
3. Cleverly hide where nobody will normally look.

Ultimately I chose option #3. My reasoning was that options #1 and #2 are only giving you a false sense of security. The linked article explains why option #1 doesn't work perfectly. With option #2, if burglars invade your home and find a safe they will rightly assume there is something valuable inside of it. With option #3 however, you aren't advertising the presence of your gold and it just seems far less likely that it will ever be found.

That's my logic any way. You are all free to poke holes in it.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:03 pm
by Cortopassi
hardlawjockey wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 pm
When I started the PP and bought my first set of gold coins I had to decide where to store it and it all boiled down to 3 options ...

1. Bank (or some other entity) safe deposit box
2. A home safe
3. Cleverly hide where nobody will normally look.

Ultimately I chose option #3. My reasoning was that options #1 and #2 are only giving you a false sense of security. The linked article explains why option #1 doesn't work perfectly. With option #2, if burglars invade your home and find a safe they will rightly assume there is something valuable inside of it. With option #3 however, you aren't advertising the presence of your gold and it just seems far less likely that it will ever be found.

That's my logic any way. You are all free to poke holes in it.
I agree with #3, but I will never have the balls to do it. Gold needs to be under some kind of lock and key to me, even if a hidden in a toilet tank, behind a fake wall plate, etc. likely would work just as well.

I also like the idea that most safes offer some level of fire protection, so if your house burns down, they might make it more intact.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:19 pm
by Xan
hardlawjockey wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 pm
When I started the PP and bought my first set of gold coins I had to decide where to store it and it all boiled down to 3 options ...

1. Bank (or some other entity) safe deposit box
2. A home safe
3. Cleverly hide where nobody will normally look.

Ultimately I chose option #3. My reasoning was that options #1 and #2 are only giving you a false sense of security. The linked article explains why option #1 doesn't work perfectly. With option #2, if burglars invade your home and find a safe they will rightly assume there is something valuable inside of it. With option #3 however, you aren't advertising the presence of your gold and it just seems far less likely that it will ever be found.

That's my logic any way. You are all free to poke holes in it.
I lost all my gold in a boating accident, but I would seriously consider diversifying, and splitting it among those three.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:20 pm
by eufo
I've been contemplating this subject a lot lately since moving into more physical gold from paper.

I think the idea of diversifying locations and methods is likely the route with the least potential for being ruined. Safe deposit boxes can be drilled, confiscated, or become unavailable in a crisis. Home safes can be stolen or opened through coercion. Hidden spots can be forgotten when moving, accidentally found by the wrong party, or even thrown out.

Multiple locations in the home and at least one location (preferably more) outside of the home seems prudent. None is guaranteed, but a good mix should protect against a total loss.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:32 am
by boglerdude
A few coins on hand in case of emergency. . .in case you need to barter your way out of the country?

If people stop using dollars for transactions you're better off with food, water, weapons

For investment amounts...Im thinking Perth mint ETF when its out. Whats the risk, hacks? Bail-ins? Any precedents for those sorts of disasters?

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:02 am
by Mountaineer
Store it in a vat of aqua regia. I was trying to think outside the box. 8) http://www.metalminemedia.com/2013/03/g ... regia.html

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:29 pm
by Desert
Mountaineer wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:02 am
Store it in a vat of aqua regia. I was trying to think outside the box. 8) http://www.metalminemedia.com/2013/03/g ... regia.html
A solution (pun intended) that only a ChemE could love. ;)

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 2:11 pm
by ochotona
I use the vault at a locally owned community bank out in a rural part of Texas.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 3:07 pm
by hardlawjockey
Xan wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:19 pm
hardlawjockey wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:24 pm
When I started the PP and bought my first set of gold coins I had to decide where to store it and it all boiled down to 3 options ...

1. Bank (or some other entity) safe deposit box
2. A home safe
3. Cleverly hide where nobody will normally look.

Ultimately I chose option #3. My reasoning was that options #1 and #2 are only giving you a false sense of security. The linked article explains why option #1 doesn't work perfectly. With option #2, if burglars invade your home and find a safe they will rightly assume there is something valuable inside of it. With option #3 however, you aren't advertising the presence of your gold and it just seems far less likely that it will ever be found.

That's my logic any way. You are all free to poke holes in it.
I lost all my gold in a boating accident, but I would seriously consider diversifying, and splitting it among those three.
My diversification consists of ETF's and about a year's worth of living expenses in #3. Probably won't be buying any more physical gold.

Not sure which of those two is the safest but I don't spend much time worrying about it.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 3:15 pm
by bedraggled
Ocho, does a community bank in a rural area give a feeling of security? I have a good safe deposit box situation but I wonder now after reading this thread.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:04 pm
by ochotona
I know the staff by name, so I believe they'd let me in to empty my box in advance of any emergency banking system shutdown. The contents are insured also.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 9:06 pm
by bedraggled
Thanks. My box may not be as well situated.

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2018 10:05 am
by Mountaineer
ochotona wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 2:11 pm
I use the vault at a locally owned community bank out in a rural part of Texas.
Oh what the addition of a u and and an l do to a perfectly good storage solution. ;)

Re: Safe Deposit Box Location

Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:04 pm
by Ad Orientem
Everybody has their anecdotal horror stories. But what you want to look at are statistical probabilities. There is no 100% guaranteed safe form of storage, but a safe deposit box is in almost all circumstances going to be safer than any form of home storage. I don't care how bad ass your home safe is, when they have a gun to your daughter's head and tell you to open the safe, well that's what you are going to do. Keeping any substantial stockpile of gold/silver/cash around the house is a really bad idea. Do things sometimes go wrong with safe deposit boxes? Yes. What is the realistic level of danger? Not enough for me to lose sleep over it. That said I do check every six months or so, just to be sure. Could the planet lose all electric power from some freak solar event? Yes. But from a statistical point of view you would be better of spending your time planning how to spend/invest your powerball winnings.