Gyroscopic Investing

GTU is currently selling at a 4.6% discount to NAV!

Shhhhhh! 

It wouldn't be a crazy thing to transition from GLD or IAU to GTU during this period.

As usual, I followed your sage advice, M.T.

Yep, me too. A deal like that is too awesome to pass up. I remember when GTU was trading at a 7% premium.

MangoMan wrote: I forget...is there any restriction against holding a PFIC like GTU in an IRA?

Not to my knowledge.

If someone knows something different, please chime in.

I just did it in a 401k without drama.

I own it in a Roth IRA, and I haven't any issues.  My accountant says it's fine...

In taxable accounts, it's time to sell some physical for a tax loss harvest, buy GTU, then exchange back after 30 days and after GTU discount decreases. A win-win.

Edit: Or maybe more appropriately, a lose-win-win. 

BearBones wrote: In taxable accounts, it's time to sell some physical for a tax loss harvest, buy GTU, then exchange back after 30 days and after GTU discount decreases. A win-win.

The current discount is unlikely to cover the premium and transaction costs for both selling and rebuying physical.  There's a lot of built-in costs that take a long time to overcome.

MachineGhost wrote:

BearBones wrote: In taxable accounts, it's time to sell some physical for a tax loss harvest, buy GTU, then exchange back after 30 days and after GTU discount decreases. A win-win.

The current discount is unlikely to cover the premium and transaction costs for both selling and rebuying physical.  There's a lot of built-in costs that take a long time to overcome.

Although not a bad time then to sell IAU for the tax-harvest loss for GTU. Nice that these are technically different so you don't have to worry as much about the wash sale rule. Sucks for TurboTax you have to paper file though since they don't offer the form yet.

What is the ER on GTU?

Ad Orientem wrote: What is the ER on GTU?

I don't recall, but it's very low. 

In the same ballpark as GLD and IAU.

MediumTex wrote:

Ad Orientem wrote: What is the ER on GTU?

I don't recall, but it's very low. 

In the same ballpark as GLD and IAU.

IAU is pretty reasonable but I think GLD is a bit pricey for an indexed fund.

What is the ER on GTU?

GTU  .36
IAU  .25
GLD  .40

It's 0.4% I believe.

I seem to recall reading somewhere that GTU didn't perform as well at tracking actual gold prices as PHYS, which is another closed-end fund with holdings in Canada.  Does anyone know anything about this?

It's good enough IMHO:

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Besides, those times when the lines diverge are great arbitrage opportunities! 

Pointedstick wrote: It's good enough IMHO:

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Besides, those times when the lines diverse are great arbitrage opportunities! 

If you understand the premium expansion/contraction, GTU can be a marvelous fund.

Thinking about doing this tomorrow; is there an intraday report of price to NAV somewhere? I have seen the end of day report at Central Gold Trust.

I may be the last guy to see this, but on the off chance that others have not, GTU ninja steve posted this tool a year ago as a means for determining the nav intraday, with a delay in GTU price of about 15 minutes, so for me, close enough. Thanks, steve!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv? ... y=CNzzi40L

6 Iron wrote: I may be the last guy to see this, but on the off chance that others have not, GTU ninja steve posted this tool a year ago as a means for determining the nav intraday, with a delay in GTU price of about 15 minutes, so for me, close enough. Thanks, steve!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv? ... y=CNzzi40L

That's awesome.  Thanks for reminding us about it.

It looks like a lot of that discount to NAV from Friday and Monday has closed up.  Those big discounts don't last long.  It's gone from -4.5% to -1.5%.

@6 Iron
Wow. Thanks for posting.

Closed at about a 5% discount today.

rickb wrote: Closed at about a 5% discount today.

I remember debating with someone the merits, and lack thereof, of closed ended gold funds. He was adamant that the premiums could only go one way no matter how strongly I cautioned that when gold started to sink, that the premiums could indeed go negative.