The Permanent Health Diet

[MachineGhost]

[quote=http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 ... 0/abstract]
Accumulating evidence suggests relationship of compositional changes of gut microbiota with onset of metabolic disorders and obesity. Kimchi, a traditional Korean side dish, is known for its beneficial impact on metabolic parameters and anti-obesity effects. The current study was designed to evaluate the association between gut microbiota and human genome after kimchi intervention in an effort to understand the molecular mechanism(s) underlying the antiobesity impact of kimchi. Twenty-four obese women were randomly assigned to either fresh or fermented kimchi group for eight weeks of kimchi intervention. Pyrosequencing of fecal microbiota and microarray analyses of blood samples revealed that fresh and fermented kimchi interventions exerted differential effects on the obesity-related clinical parameters. Correlations of these effects with changes in blood gene expression and gut microbial population were more evident in the fermented kimchi group than the fresh kimchi group.[/quote]

[MachineGhost]

Here's an updated optimal macro-nutrient in grams matrix (I need to eat more carbs):

Code: Select all

Calories	100.0%	1750	2000	2500
Protein		15.0%	66	75	94
Total Fats	53.0%	103	118	147
Omega-6 Max	4.0%	8	9	11
Omega-3 Max	1.5%	3	3	4
Total Carbs	32.0%	140	160	200
Safe Starches	20.0%	88	100	125
Sugars/Fructose	10.0%	44	50	63
Sol/Insol Fiber	1.0%	7	8	10
Resist Starch	1.0%	7	8	10

[screwtape]

Don't take this the wrong way MG but do you think there is any chance you might be suffering from a little OCD?

Here's an updated optimal macro-nutrient in grams matrix (I need to eat more carbs):

Code: Select all

Calories	100.0%	1750	2000	2500
Protein		15.0%	66	75	94
Total Fats	53.0%	103	118	147
Omega-6 Max	4.0%	8	9	11
Omega-3 Max	1.5%	3	3	4
Total Carbs	32.0%	140	160	200
Safe Starches	20.0%	88	100	125
Sugars/Fructose	10.0%	44	50	63
Sol/Insol Fiber	1.0%	7	8	10
Resist Starch	1.0%	7	8	10

[MachineGhost]

Don't take this the wrong way MG but do you think there is any chance you might be suffering from a little OCD?

Well, what's the alternative?  Not having a blueprint or plan that needs updating now and then to get through life?  I see the miserable results of widespread ignorance all around me, so I rather be a little OCD than that... unspeakable horror.

[align=center][img width=800]http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/scream.jpg[/img][/align]

P.S.  This is also another difference between 46 and 66, though I wonder if its not generational...

[screwtape]

I'm sure I'm not the only one who might have entertained the thought that you might obsess over these things just a tad too much, just the first one (maybe not but I haven't read every post) willing to come out and say it.

But I do recall your post on hamburgers so no I don't think you are bat-shit crazy OCD just a little more than most of us.

As for the other difference between 46 and 66 would be interested to hear your observation.

Don't take this the wrong way MG but do you think there is any chance you might be suffering from a little OCD?

Well, what's the alternative?  Not having a blueprint or plan that needs updating now and then to get through life?  I see the miserable results of widespread ignorance all around me, so I rather be a little OCD than that... unspeakable horror.

[align=center][img width=800]http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/scream.jpg[/img][/align]

P.S.  This is also another difference between 46 and 66, though I wonder if its not generational...

[moda0306]

We all strive mental stimulation and game-playing.

Why not turn important topics into a game rather than meaningless ones?

I for one like MG's geekery. Sure he may have other areas that would deliver him more marginal benefit to research, but I think what you put in your body is both of huge fundamental importance to your overall happiness and can be extremely interesting.

I tend to look at diet/health now all as an RPG. I have to level up different aspects of my health, and each has points of diminishing or perhaps negative returns if I focus too much on it. It's actually kind of fun, and I feel way better and have lost like 35 lbs as a result.

[screwtape]

I for one like MG's geekery.

Me too. Didn't mean to imply otherwise.

I like Mountaineer's expression of his Christian faith too so I don't know if either one of them will consider that an insult by comparison.

[MachineGhost]

I'm sure I'm not the only one who might have entertained the thought that you might obsess over these things just a tad too much, just the first one (maybe not but I haven't read every post) willing to come out and say it.

But I do recall your post on hamburgers so no I don't think you are bat-shit crazy OCD just a little more than most of us.

Well, there's so much B.S. in life, it took adopting an Rationalist mindset as a core principle to dig out the actual truth in any subject.  I was not always like that and went with the flow like most everyone else and was even ideological, but at a certain point I realized that it was not the path for continual growth in terms of actions meeting proclaimed end results.  I think nowadays with all the marketing fiction and spin compared to several decades ago, you are hopelessly lost if you don't have some serious critical thinking skills to navigate it all in many different areas, even right down to choosing a box of food at the grocery store.  You cannot appeal to authority anymore or its at your own peril healthwise and/or financially.  I know others don't have the tenacity, skill or the free time that I do, so I freely share my research and results.

And BTW, growth and happiness are not mutually exclusive.  Would I love to be a hedonist and worry very little about the results of my actions?  Of course.  But I don't think that will prepare us for the future which is going to be even more complex, complicated and difficult to navigate than what has come before (well, unless we offload all our thinking and labor to robots and turn into hedonistic beached whales).

I guess libertarians have an OCD affinity for efficiency.  I want to level up in the RPG (great concept, moda!) of life as efficiently as possible!  Knowledge is power; wisdom is immortality.

[Mountaineer]

I for one like MG's geekery.

Me too. Didn't mean to imply otherwise.

I like Mountaineer's expression of his Christian faith too so I don't know if either one of them will consider that an insult by comparison.

No insult for me.  I believe you are what you eat.  Actually and metaphorically.  That is why I go hear the Word and receive the body and blood of Christ in addition to my bacon, eggs, steak, butter, beer, scotch, broccoli, and Caesar salad. 

I have trouble though, envisioning what the outcome of taking too many herbal supplements, having only orgasmic free range pheasant to eat, drinking only water that has been filtered through Peruvian alpaca hair, and listening to too much Quran while meditating on Tom Cruise movies - something like Dante and the 9 circles of Hell? 

... Mountaineer

[MachineGhost]

Ben Greenfield on the 4 Dangers of a Low-Carb, High-Fat Diet

http://blog.wellnessfx.com/2014/01/07/b ... -fat-diet/

[l82start]

it made me think the same thing... there is no perfect health diet.... everything you are supposed to eat, or supposed to stop eating, or cook in different cookware, or cook at a different temp, or eat a different quantity of, will have a negative reaction with something else you are supposed to eat, or supposed to stop eating, or cook in different cookware, or cook at a different temp or eat a different quantity of 

i am thinking the perfect heath diet is the Standard American Diet cockroach version.. eat anything and everything you want, stuff your self till it hurts, if it doesn't kill you you will build strength and immunity to eating crap,   
  after the nuclear Armageddon, sitting atop the rubble, lit by the red glow of the waste painted sunset, you will feast, fat and happy on rusty cans of radioactive, botulism tainted food ..
all these health nuts will be long gone from getting 12 nano-grams to much iron combined with a .0005 ppm to high cholesterol count years before the bombs ever go off..

[MachineGhost]

But seriously, MG, what are you thinking now, regarding diet?  We really need to establish a "permanent diet."  And it needs to include red wine and brisket, please.

I've done some recent research, but I haven't changed my mind about the PHD other than that there may be a need for higher carb intake in certain people, like myself.  But having checked out older blog posts, I noticed Jaminet said that we need no lower than 800 calories of carbohydrates to drive the brain and provide juice for mucus, the organs, joints, etc..  That's 200 grams not the 150 grams he recommends officially for sedentary individuals.  Aha!  So I think he may be relying on gluconeogensis of protein to make up the difference above that, which is stupid.  My logic as a weekly non-sedentary individual that is highly stressed out is it may be better to take the full 200g and save the protein for what it is actually primed for.  Jaminet also admits we don't really know what the optimal carb intake is exactly and proposed a theory to tell what intake is optimal for any individual (by measuring rT3/T3, since insufficient carbs suppress thyroid and increases rT3 which inhibits conversion of T3 into the active T4).

If I interpreted it correctly, my recent bloodwork suggests I'm not eating enough carbs (and my mood and body certainly suggested it).  From what very little I can find of others with similar values, Jaminet suggested more carb intake.  So we'll see.

Avoiding Omega-6 and fructose is still prudent as they clearly have deleterious effect on health; but I do believe the "toxins" in carbs may be more of an implication of a damaged gut microbiome than them being toxic per se.  Many of the "toxins" have very beneficial health effects beyond potentially damaging the gut.  Also, saturated fat turns harmful when carbs are at/past a certain percent in the diet (55%).  It's further complicated by the iron issue the Duck Dodgers team identified.

[MachineGhost]

I think it might have been TN who said something like "It almost seems like no matter what I eat, I'm going to end up dying one day."

If we are to die, then the key is to square the mortality curve so that you spend the least amount of time being in sickness, pain and disability at the end of your life.  That's the whole point of a PHD.  Those that live for the moment and throw caution to the wind will pay the price with 20-30 years of painful end of life misery.  There's no free lunch, though I'm quite certain Big Pharma/Biotech will try its darndest to come up with pharmaceuticals/engineering to fix the poor lifestyle choices of the spoiled and ignorant.

[MachineGhost]

Thanks for the reply.  Can you give me an idea how this translates into actual food choices? 

My diet these days consists mainly of meat, eggs, veggies, rice, potatoes, sweet potatoes, salads, etc.  Being a cheapskate, I'd like to get more calories from bulk rice and garden veggies, and less from meat, etc.  But I don't want to sacrifice health for a few bucks either. 

My family and I are still working our way through half a grass-fed cow I purchased last year.  It's been good eating for me and the wife, but my 8 year old son never wants to see beef again (except in taco form).

I edited my post after you replied, so please re-read it. 

Bottom line: avoid grains, anything fortified, Omega-6/transfat/hydrogenated, fructose/HFCS and keep your safe carb intake between 150g-200g a day unless you're an athlete.  To keep gut healthy, I'd experiment with eating legumes, nuts, seeds once or twice a week.  Eat liberally with the protein and fat but remember that calories still determine whether or not you gain weight.  I'd also not eat red meat serially due to the iron overload which makes saturated fat harmful regardless of the carb percentage.

Yes that means you better wash your fortified rice until it is clear (reduces the fortification by 50% max) and then start buying for export-only rice that isn't fortified.  A safe brand of canned beans that soaks it overnight is Eden Foods.

P.S.  Since we're starting to creep away from the PHD diet, I'm renaming the thread.

[l82start]

Thanks for the reply.  Can you give me an idea how this translates into actual food choices? 

My diet these days consists mainly of meat, eggs, veggies, rice, potatoes, sweet potatoes, salads, etc.  Being a cheapskate, I'd like to get more calories from bulk rice and garden veggies, and less from meat, etc.  But I don't want to sacrifice health for a few bucks either. 

My family and I are still working our way through half a grass-fed cow I purchased last year.  It's been good eating for me and the wife, but my 8 year old son never wants to see beef again (except in taco form).

I edited my post after you replied, so please re-read it. 

Bottom line: avoid grains, anything fortified, Omega-6/transfat/hydrogenated, fructose/HFCS and keep your safe carb intake between 150g-200g a day unless you're an athlete.  To keep gut healthy, I'd experiment with eating legumes, nuts, seeds once or twice a week.  Eat liberally with the protein and fat but remember that calories still determine whether or not you gain weight.  I'd also not eat red meat serially due to the iron overload which makes saturated fat harmful regardless of the carb percentage.

Yes that means you better wash your fortified rice until it is clear (reduces the fortification by 50% max) and then start buying for export-only rice that isn't fortified.  A safe brand of canned beans that soaks it overnight is Eden Foods.

isn't it calories + hormones + metabolism + activity (and type of activity) = whether or not you gain weight?

i don t think a strict calorie in calorie burned calculation is considered accurate outside of government recommendations and weight-loss diet scams any more..

[MachineGhost]

isn't it calories + hormones + metabolism + activity (and type of activity) = whether or not you gain weight?

i don t think a strict calorie in calorie burned calculation is considered accurate outside of government recommendations and weight-loss diet scams any more..

Well, you have to tailor your calorie intake to yourself.  I've never understood the official government calorie recommendations for a sedentary individual.  It would have me blow up like a balloon if I ate that much calories which is about what I eat only after lifting weights!

The thyroid alone is responsive to carbohydrate intake according to studies.  Too low carbs and you will have an elevated TSH attempting to get the thyroid to do its job.  Which is not a bad thing from a longevity perspective but there's a list of unpleasant side effects that can go along with it.  Women seem the most suspectible.

[l82start]

isn't it calories + hormones + metabolism + activity (and type of activity) = whether or not you gain weight?

i don t think a strict calorie in calorie burned calculation is considered accurate outside of government recommendations and weight-loss diet scams any more..

Well, you have to tailor your calorie intake to yourself.  I've never understood the official government calorie recommendations for a sedentary individual.  It would have me blow up like a balloon if I ate that much calories which is about what I eat after lifting weights!

i only just recently started tracking and documenting calorie intake and macro nutrient %'s but in the past as long as i stay (reasonably) low carb i could bounce around what seemed like a pretty wide range of calorie intakes without triggering  fat storage, blow up like a balloon mode (which i have been in in the past  )

[Mountaineer]

But seriously, MG, what are you thinking now, regarding diet?  We really need to establish a "permanent diet."  And it needs to include red wine and brisket, please.

I haven't changed my mind about the diet other than that there may be a need for higher carb intake in certain people, like myself.  But having checked out older blog posts, I noticed Jaminet said that we need no lower than 800 calories of carbohydrates to drive the brain and provide juice for mucus, the organs, joints, etc..  That's 200 grams not the 150 grams he recommends officially for sedentary individuals.  So I think he may be relying on gluconeogensis of protein to make up the difference above that, which is stupid.  My logic as a weekly non-sedentary individual is it is better to take the full 200g and preserve the protein for what it is actually primed for.  He also admits we don't really know what the optimal intake is and proposed a theory to tell what intake is optimal for an individual (by measuring rT3/T3).

If I interpreted it correctly, my bloodwork suggests I'm not eating enough carbs (and my mood and body certainly suggested it).  From what little I can find of others with similar values, Jaminet suggested more carb intake.  So we'll see.

Avoiding Omega-6 and fructose is still prudent as they clearly have deleterious effect on health; but I do believe the "toxins" in carbs may be more of an implication of a damaged gut microbiome than them being toxic per se.  Many of the "toxins" have beneficial health effects.

Thanks for the reply.  Can you give me an idea how this translates into actual food choices? 

My diet these days consists mainly of meat, eggs, veggies, rice, potatoes, sweet potatoes, salads, etc.  Being a cheapskate, I'd like to get more calories from bulk rice and garden veggies, and less from meat, etc.  But I don't want to sacrifice health for a few bucks either. 

My family and I are still working our way through half a grass-fed cow I purchased last year.  It's been good eating for me and the wife, but my 8 year old son never wants to see beef again (except in taco form).

Jeeze, you should have killed it, cut it up, packaged and frozen it.  That must be really traumatic for your son to see a bloody half-eaten cow hobbling around in the back yard - not to mention the incessant mooing, belching and farting.  I guess your method does have a bright side - reduced need for mowing. 

... Mountaineer

[Mountaineer]

I think it might have been TN who said something like "It almost seems like no matter what I eat, I'm going to end up dying one day."

If we are to die, then the key is to square the mortality curve so that you spend the least amount of time being in sickness, pain and disability at the end of your life.  That's the whole point of a PHD.  Those that live for the moment and throw caution to the wind will pay the price with 20-30 years of painful end of life misery.  There's no free lunch, though I'm quite certain Big Pharma/Biotech will try its darndest to come up with pharmaceuticals/engineering to fix the poor lifestyle choices of the spoiled and ignorant.

IF??????  And why the heck does having a doctorate matter?  And furthermore, there are plenty of free lunches out there, also cell phones, housing, and medical.  You just need to vote correctly and often.  Don't beliieve me, ask moda. 

... Mountaineer